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First-in-human implantation of bionic device to halt Crohn's disease (2023)

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21–30 of 129 posts

Re: First-in-human implantation of bionic device to halt Crohn's disease (2023)

#21

This paper seems to describe the general strategy: Neuronal regulation of the gut immune system and neuromodulation for treating inflammatory bowel disease https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8565205/ It would be incredible if it works, since it would avoid treatment with systemic immunosuppresives which can promote infection/cancer. However maybe there is still a local risk of the above? I would also be con…

I highly doubt that this would obviate the need for biologics, but I think it would probably work very well in combination.

Re: First-in-human implantation of bionic device to halt Crohn's disease (2023)

#22
post #11

This paper seems to describe the general strategy: Neuronal regulation of the gut immune system and neuromodulation for treating inflammatory bowel disease https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8565205/ It would be incredible if it works, since it would avoid treatment with systemic immunosuppresives which can promote infection/cancer. However maybe there is still a local risk of the above? I would also be con…

I think most of these claims are BS, but I've met several people who have claimed to heal their own inflammatory diseases through non-medical practice to help regulate their vagus nerve. I know for me, these types of practices seem to help manage my symptoms. So maybe there is some connection.

That’s wishful thinking. Please don’t go off your IBD meds or you will regret it some day.

Re: First-in-human implantation of bionic device to halt Crohn's disease (2023)

#23
post #7

I have Crohn’s but am one of the lucky 20% who is in long-term remission without surgery and without the more problematic drug therapies - thus far! But if this works as well as hoped it will bring a lot of peace of mind that if I do ever need surgery, I won’t be going back in for more every few years. Medical research is awesome, for all its inefficiencies.

Which drugs are you talking about? Pretty much all the biologics for CD have amazingly positive safety profiles…

Re: First-in-human implantation of bionic device to halt Crohn's disease (2023)

#24
I initially wrote this as a reply to a comment by "NotGMan" mentioning fasting/paleo that got flagged. They could have approached the subject more delicately but I believe they have a point.

About 3 years ago I had gut issues so bad I thought I was close to death. NHS couldn't see any problems and were basically telling me I'd gone nuts. They refused to do any further testing.

After a year of suffering I tried a 7 day water-only fast and the pain finally went away. I broke fast with only paleo foods and stayed that way for 6 months. I gradually introduced other foods after that period with the last being gluten about 2 years after the initial fast. I am almost cured, however I will never abuse my gut in the same way again. Less carbs, more salads...

This is just my personal experience of course but I have discovered so many other people with similar gut issues who are also being ignored by their doctors that you can't blame one for wondering if there is a conspiracy at play.

I wouldn't have believed any of this a few years ago but now I have serious doubts in modern medicine's ability to deal with chronic health issues, especially in the gut.

We do eat so many more processed foods (and other things) that it doesn't require that much of a stretch to the imagination that diet is a part of the problem or indeed the root cause.

Lack of openmindedness bothers me immensely and the nature of human biology is under no obligation to fit into tidy boxes for the sake of our understanding. The real world is fuzzy.

Re: First-in-human implantation of bionic device to halt Crohn's disease (2023)

#25
post #11

This paper seems to describe the general strategy: Neuronal regulation of the gut immune system and neuromodulation for treating inflammatory bowel disease https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8565205/ It would be incredible if it works, since it would avoid treatment with systemic immunosuppresives which can promote infection/cancer. However maybe there is still a local risk of the above? I would also be con…

I think most of these claims are BS, but I've met several people who have claimed to heal their own inflammatory diseases through non-medical practice to help regulate their vagus nerve. I know for me, these types of practices seem to help manage my symptoms. So maybe there is some connection.

[deleted]

Re: First-in-human implantation of bionic device to halt Crohn's disease (2023)

#26
post #11

This paper seems to describe the general strategy: Neuronal regulation of the gut immune system and neuromodulation for treating inflammatory bowel disease https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8565205/ It would be incredible if it works, since it would avoid treatment with systemic immunosuppresives which can promote infection/cancer. However maybe there is still a local risk of the above? I would also be con…

I think most of these claims are BS, but I've met several people who have claimed to heal their own inflammatory diseases through non-medical practice to help regulate their vagus nerve. I know for me, these types of practices seem to help manage my symptoms. So maybe there is some connection.

The vagus nerve sits inside the collarbone right next to the carotid artery. As a doctor told me once, if you're able to physically stimulate your vagus nerve, you need to get to A&E posthaste, lol

Re: First-in-human implantation of bionic device to halt Crohn's disease (2023)

#27
post #24

I initially wrote this as a reply to a comment by "NotGMan" mentioning fasting/paleo that got flagged. They could have approached the subject more delicately but I believe they have a point. About 3 years ago I had gut issues so bad I thought I was close to death. NHS couldn't see any problems and were basically telling me I'd gone nuts. They refused to do any further testing. After a year of suffering I tried a 7 da…

Decades ago, about 30% of the people who had celiac disease would waste away and die, especially children. Until a doctor noticed that if the people ate 12 bananas a day they seemed to do better. Of course, 12 bananas a day is a kooky diet, but people who eat 12 bananas a day tend to eat less of everything else, including less bread and gluten and so they would do better. Later science figured out bread was a problem and then eventually identified the specific protein (gluten) that effects people with celiac disease.

I think there are other foods that bother different people, but we haven't managed pin down exactly which foods bother which people. It's a hard problem, but surely there are other cases of "if you just avoid this specific food ingredient, you will recover", just like celiac disease.

So, on the one hand, sharing advice about which diets worked and didn't work can be helpful (like the 12 bananas a day diet). On the other hand, "I tried an unusual diet, which also happens to have a good amount of marketing behind it, and things are better" is one of the most common bits of advice you'll find for many diseases, and the problem is everyone recommends a different diet.

A relative of mine has Chrons disease and was close to death before it was diagnosed, the doctors recommended a junk food diet basically, high calorie foods with almost no fiber, and that's how he eats now and is doing much better. I don't recommend everyone follow the same diet, but for whatever it's worth, eating junk food has helped my relative, true story.

And this is what I mean, there's so much conflicting advice about which diet to try. I can't fault people for trying different diets, because I believe there are many unknown disease, like celiac disease, which can be treated with an exact (but as of yet unknown) diet. I also don't fault people for giving up and not enthusiastically trying every diet-of-the-week that gets suggested, it's tiring. Also, it's notable that the diets with the most marketing tend to be the ones most recommended.

Re: First-in-human implantation of bionic device to halt Crohn's disease (2023)

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would also be concerned about the implant getting covered in nasty biofilms over time. The implant doesn't necessarily sit inside the gut though does it ? Just somewhere it can ping the relevant nerve.

I don't have the citation for this, but I learned in a class long ago that most implanted devices end up covered in biofilms, it's only a matter of time. Especially if it's plastic. e.g. breast implants, catheters, etc.

Bacterial biofilms? On implanted implants? How do they get there?

Re: First-in-human implantation of bionic device to halt Crohn's disease (2023)

#29
post #24

I initially wrote this as a reply to a comment by "NotGMan" mentioning fasting/paleo that got flagged. They could have approached the subject more delicately but I believe they have a point. About 3 years ago I had gut issues so bad I thought I was close to death. NHS couldn't see any problems and were basically telling me I'd gone nuts. They refused to do any further testing. After a year of suffering I tried a 7 da…

Decades ago, about 30% of the people who had celiac disease would waste away and die, especially children. Until a doctor noticed that if the people ate 12 bananas a day they seemed to do better. Of course, 12 bananas a day is a kooky diet, but people who eat 12 bananas a day tend to eat less of everything else, including less bread and gluten and so they would do better. Later science figured out bread was a problem…

Thank you for taking the time to reply and not just downvoting me. That is enlightening and I'm glad your relative is in better health now.

I'm certainly not suggesting there is a single treatment plan that'll work for everyone. As I said biology is fuzzy and it annoys me when people try to debug health issues like they were pieces of software. Discussing these things openly does help however.

Re: First-in-human implantation of bionic device to halt Crohn's disease (2023)

#30
post #7

I have Crohn’s but am one of the lucky 20% who is in long-term remission without surgery and without the more problematic drug therapies - thus far! But if this works as well as hoped it will bring a lot of peace of mind that if I do ever need surgery, I won’t be going back in for more every few years. Medical research is awesome, for all its inefficiencies.

How did you do it?
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