Live data from Hacker News

End of an era: Final Delta IV heavy rocket carries NROL-70 on historic mission

floridamedianow.com

21–29 of 29 posts

Re: End of an era: Final Delta IV heavy rocket carries NROL-70 on historic mission

#21
post #12

We changed the URL from https://www.spacedaily.com/reports/End_of_an_Era_Final_Delta... to an article that seems to have more background information. Is there a better article available? If so, we can change it again.

>Is there a better article available? If so, we can change it again.

Ars has pretty solid space coverage and I think their article [0] is fairly extensive with a few more technical details on aspects specific to DIVH. Also not related to changing the article, but first comment there links a pretty cool little movie [1] (yes absolutely PR completely with dramatic music but still real footage and DIVH is a damn cool, however expensive, rocket) ULA did on the NROL-91 launch which really was dramatic.

----

0: https://arstechnica.com/space/2024/03/the-delta-iv-heavy-a-r...

1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXifOiq56uw

Re: End of an era: Final Delta IV heavy rocket carries NROL-70 on historic mission

#22
post #8

Missing the most important piece of info about any NRO launch, the mission patch! Meow! https://www.nro.gov/portals/135/assets/img/L-70_Snow-Leopard...

That isn't a real patch, more of a mission logo. The details are too small. The pink nose, if actually in patch form, would stand out as a pink dot in the middle of a blurry cat. Fyi, military patches look best when using lines with fixed-width. Anything pointy or jagged doesn't translate well into stitched thread. Avoid shadows too. Yes, there are some all-plastic patches that are carved into 3d shapes but those are…

I'm actually very very interested in this opinionated approach to patch design -- can you tell me more? Or refer me to some useful design guides? I can just google something random too, but it sounds like you might know / have some good resources already

Re: End of an era: Final Delta IV heavy rocket carries NROL-70 on historic mission

#23
post #8

Missing the most important piece of info about any NRO launch, the mission patch! Meow! https://www.nro.gov/portals/135/assets/img/L-70_Snow-Leopard...

Is it just me, but I feel like this being an NRO patch that the placement of the stars isn't just a designer's choice but potentially some cryptic meaning. If not, how boring!

These patches are allowed to leak exactly 0 bits of meaningful non-public information about the payload.

Re: End of an era: Final Delta IV heavy rocket carries NROL-70 on historic mission

#24
post #2

This article sounds like it was written by ChatGPT. That said, it's wild we were still using expendable rockets like Delta IV Heavy when SpaceX offerings are objectively better & cheaper. What SpaceX has done for the industry is nothing short of incredible.

I think that's a bit overly reductionist. This launch cost about $150m (granted, without competition from SpaceX it probably would've been much pricier). I think the going rate for a Falcon Heavy is around $120m. Not a huge difference, and it's very possible that changing the mission requirements to work with Falcon Heavy would cost more than $30m. In the past SpaceX had limitations like no vertical integration, narr…

Is SpaceX running out of patience with slow, or near nonexistent growth of so-called launch market?

Re: End of an era: Final Delta IV heavy rocket carries NROL-70 on historic mission

#25
post #8

Missing the most important piece of info about any NRO launch, the mission patch! Meow! https://www.nro.gov/portals/135/assets/img/L-70_Snow-Leopard...

That isn't a real patch, more of a mission logo. The details are too small. The pink nose, if actually in patch form, would stand out as a pink dot in the middle of a blurry cat. Fyi, military patches look best when using lines with fixed-width. Anything pointy or jagged doesn't translate well into stitched thread. Avoid shadows too. Yes, there are some all-plastic patches that are carved into 3d shapes but those are…

There's a general term for this, designing for manufacturability[0].

I've made something of a hobby of learning new ways to manufacture things. Every time I learn a new manufacturing technique I start to notice things that were made that way in the real world, and I especially start to notice aspects of design that would have been influenced by how the thing in question was manufactured.

Case in point: injection molding. When you injection mold parts, the sides have to be tapered so that the part can detach from the mold easily (the term of art for that is "drafting"[1]). Once you know that, you see it everywhere.

Back to the topic at hand: owning an embroidery machine and learning how to digitize completely opened my mind to all the intricacies of patch design and why all of what the parent comment said is true. Case in point:

> military patches look best when using lines with fixed-width

This is because the thread itself is fixed width, and you can either do a straight stitch for really thin lines (they call that a running stitch[2]) or you can do a sort of zigzag stitch that's so tight that the thread runs horizontally and fills up the line width (they call that a satin stitch[3]). Satin stitches only look good within a certain narrow range of widths; wider and the threads are too loose, narrower and the needle holes are close enough that they impact the structural integrity of the backing the design's being embroidered on to.

Anyway. I could go on for hours, but to wrap up: DFM is a fascinating world to explore.

[0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Design_for_manufacturability

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft_(engineering)

[2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straight_stitch

[3] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satin_stitch

Re: End of an era: Final Delta IV heavy rocket carries NROL-70 on historic mission

#26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That isn't a real patch, more of a mission logo. The details are too small. The pink nose, if actually in patch form, would stand out as a pink dot in the middle of a blurry cat. Fyi, military patches look best when using lines with fixed-width. Anything pointy or jagged doesn't translate well into stitched thread. Avoid shadows too. Yes, there are some all-plastic patches that are carved into 3d shapes but those are…

I'm actually very very interested in this opinionated approach to patch design -- can you tell me more? Or refer me to some useful design guides? I can just google something random too, but it sounds like you might know / have some good resources already

The term you'll want to search for is "digitizing". It's roughly the embroidery equivalent of CAM design in CNC manufacturing.

Depending on how much time you have, this video[0] is a decent in-depth overview[1] of the various ins and outs of embroidery patch digitizing. I'd give it a watch while you're on a walk or something.

[0] https://www.youtube.com/live/jATHlfz8mtM?si=Lvw-ZTq8tmLg9ij-

[1] Heh, "in-depth overview" sounds like a total oxymoron. Hopefully you get what I meant!

Re: End of an era: Final Delta IV heavy rocket carries NROL-70 on historic mission

#27
post #8

Missing the most important piece of info about any NRO launch, the mission patch! Meow! https://www.nro.gov/portals/135/assets/img/L-70_Snow-Leopard...

Is it just me, but I feel like this being an NRO patch that the placement of the stars isn't just a designer's choice but potentially some cryptic meaning. If not, how boring!

My guess: there’s 3 stars that are brighter, and the cat is shown with 3 legs, so it could be part of a constellation of 3 satellites. The swoop of the tail could indicate a molyina orbit. Generally the orbit and where these things are in the sky can, and are, tracked even by hobbyists so that’s not particularly juicy, imo

Re: End of an era: Final Delta IV heavy rocket carries NROL-70 on historic mission

#28
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's a bit overly reductionist. This launch cost about $150m (granted, without competition from SpaceX it probably would've been much pricier). I think the going rate for a Falcon Heavy is around $120m. Not a huge difference, and it's very possible that changing the mission requirements to work with Falcon Heavy would cost more than $30m. In the past SpaceX had limitations like no vertical integration, narr…

Is SpaceX running out of patience with slow, or near nonexistent growth of so-called launch market?

They have their own launch market keeping them busy. Also, even without Starlink, there has been growth in the launch market, it just happens that with modern electronics, most satellites don't need to be very large, and there are a few sets of orbits most of them want to go to. So you can just have a regularly scheduled trip to an orbit and absorb a lot of the demand in one launch.

Re: End of an era: Final Delta IV heavy rocket carries NROL-70 on historic mission

#29
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's a bit overly reductionist. This launch cost about $150m (granted, without competition from SpaceX it probably would've been much pricier). I think the going rate for a Falcon Heavy is around $120m. Not a huge difference, and it's very possible that changing the mission requirements to work with Falcon Heavy would cost more than $30m. In the past SpaceX had limitations like no vertical integration, narr…

Is SpaceX running out of patience with slow, or near nonexistent growth of so-called launch market?

The problem is satellites take a long time to manufacture, upwards of 10 years, and everything is very mass optimized. The industry is too slowly adapting to cheaper more frequent launches.
Post reply on HN