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React Labs: What We've Been Working On – February 2024

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Re: React Labs: What We've Been Working On – February 2024

#21

Post by RayVR »

cal85 wrote: post #20

Can anyone clarify how the compiler would fit into the workflow? Are we talking some kind of CLI that takes a JSX/TSX entry point as input and outputs a compiled JS bundle, like a replacement for Webpack/Rollup etc. but more specialised to optimise React code? Or something more fine-grained that operates on a single component/module at a time? Or something else?

The idea is that it should eliminate the need for things like useMemo, useCallback, etc. it seems there’s better support for promises, as well.

Re: React Labs: What We've Been Working On – February 2024

#23

Post by mewpmewp2 »

I don't think React is approachable. It is just the most popular framework and has the biggest ecosystem, that is why it is used. Otherwise it is just not good in my view compares to others.

Also I don't think useMemo or useCallback were a reasonable compromise ever.

Re: React Labs: What We've Been Working On – February 2024

#24

Post by iamflimflam1 »

throwaway220033 wrote: post #18

The goal behind "hooks" was to make React simpler for beginners. I build client-side apps since 2007, and React is getting too magical and complex for even for me. The NextJS influence is really making things worse, "use server" "use client" tags do not scale at all. The project clearly lacks mission, goal, leadership and direction. I'll use Preact in the next projects.

Can't help but agree. It's very hard, even for experienced developers, to understand what is going on with hooks.

Even knowing why they are needed requires a deep understanding of what is happening.

Definitely feels like complex implementation details leaking upwards and influencing the public API.

Re: React Labs: What We've Been Working On – February 2024

#25

Post by Couto »

omeid2 wrote: post #10

I have been using React at least since 2017 so not a hater; but how many version are we away from elm at this point? https://elm-lang.org/

React was closer to elm during the times of stateless functions and redux. Since then it's getting further apart from elm.

Redux was kinda of a poor man's elm but it got the right principles. However the JS community hates boilerplate code so, new, more complicated abstractions appeared. Also, it was too easy, with redux, to shoot yourself in the foot.

Since then, with hooks, things are just getting harder and more complicated in my opinion.

Re: React Labs: What We've Been Working On – February 2024

#26

Post by larodi »

mewpmewp2 wrote: post #23

I don't think React is approachable. It is just the most popular framework and has the biggest ecosystem, that is why it is used. Otherwise it is just not good in my view compares to others. Also I don't think useMemo or useCallback were a reasonable compromise ever.

React like angular seems to me very much a solution from a bygone time. The time when internet was slow and expensive.

I find very little reason for anyone, except services in the insta scale, to actually use this abomination, since CSS and html deliver the same user experience with plain SSR.

Re: React Labs: What We've Been Working On – February 2024

#27

Post by omeid2 »

Couto wrote: post #25
omeid2 wrote: post #10

I have been using React at least since 2017 so not a hater; but how many version are we away from elm at this point? https://elm-lang.org/

React was closer to elm during the times of stateless functions and redux. Since then it's getting further apart from elm. Redux was kinda of a poor man's elm but it got the right principles. However the JS community hates boilerplate code so, new, more complicated abstractions appeared. Also, it was too easy, with redux, to shoot yourself in the foot. Since then, with hooks, things are just getting harder and more c…

The newish `useReducer` is basically redux but tied into react like in elm.

Re: React Labs: What We've Been Working On – February 2024

#28

Post by rpastuszak »

throwaway220033 wrote: post #18

The goal behind "hooks" was to make React simpler for beginners. I build client-side apps since 2007, and React is getting too magical and complex for even for me. The NextJS influence is really making things worse, "use server" "use client" tags do not scale at all. The project clearly lacks mission, goal, leadership and direction. I'll use Preact in the next projects.

I have a similar experience to yours. I'm using preact for most things now, sveltekit for anything full-stack or when I need static generation (great fro small/mid-sized projects, haven't build anything "enterprise" with it).

I wish Remix was preact. It looks like it has parts of preact and svelte I really enjoy.

I've been using Next.js since 2016/17 at small and large SaaS scale) -- I feel like they're building it like a VS funded SaaS now. The added complexity doesn't really pay off.

Re: React Labs: What We've Been Working On – February 2024

#29

Post by slmjkdbtl »

throwaway220033 wrote: post #18

The goal behind "hooks" was to make React simpler for beginners. I build client-side apps since 2007, and React is getting too magical and complex for even for me. The NextJS influence is really making things worse, "use server" "use client" tags do not scale at all. The project clearly lacks mission, goal, leadership and direction. I'll use Preact in the next projects.

I feel embarrassed when some of the great back end / system programmers I work with have to go in the front end code base and write React. They can submit patches to linux source like it's nothing but understanding React is just too hard for them.

Re: React Labs: What We've Been Working On – February 2024

#30

Post by revscat »

throwaway220033 wrote: post #18

The goal behind "hooks" was to make React simpler for beginners. I build client-side apps since 2007, and React is getting too magical and complex for even for me. The NextJS influence is really making things worse, "use server" "use client" tags do not scale at all. The project clearly lacks mission, goal, leadership and direction. I'll use Preact in the next projects.

Same realization. I started playing around with Rails/Hotwire and found that to be much more productive and far simpler. Haven’t used it for anything “real” yet, but I am enjoying it so far.
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