Live data from Hacker News

Yishan Wong: "Google's Gemini issue is not about woke/DEI"

twitter.com

21–30 of 137 posts

Re: Yishan Wong: "Google's Gemini issue is not about woke/DEI"

#21
Great piece.

I mean I think the google woke issue is another thing but not so much to the culture war but more that we need to be careful with the instructions we give AI and why we give them. Should we be preoccupied with whether or not people will be offended by the output of AI? Surely if we train the AI “the right way” we won’t need to add blanket rules.

Re: Yishan Wong: "Google's Gemini issue is not about woke/DEI"

#22
Sounds like algowashing, a.k.a. plausible deniability for the results of their models. Because it's a statistical model and not lines of code, they could go to the public and say "This model is sO cOmPlIcAtEd that not even we could have foreseen these results!" when their thumbs are on scales all over the place. I fear what happens when AI criminal profiling models flag undesirables as definitely psychotic serial killers ("just sprinkle some crack on him/some CP on his computer" with extra computer-mediated steps) or when, say, a hospital's AI cancer diagnostic model flags a sponsor's rival as "terminal - hook him up to the MAID machine and run him through the checkout line", and no one can point to evidence that shows the models are being manipulated despite that everyone knows they are.

Re: Yishan Wong: "Google's Gemini issue is not about woke/DEI"

#24
post #9

In a nutshell for those without a X account: the problem here isn't that Google's AI gave "woke" results. The big problem here is that even one of the biggest AI specialists in the world, Google, wasn't able to fully predict or control the output of its AI. If we ever create a truly powerful, superintelligent AI under the assumption that we'll be able to control it, this incident shows that even a minor mistake from…

In amazed that the very large corporation didn't have a competent red team doing simple prompt tomfoolery to discover this.

After all prompt shenanigans are a well known issue.

Re: Yishan Wong: "Google's Gemini issue is not about woke/DEI"

#25

Surely there was internal dogfooding for this feature, I do not believed they would add a new system prompt and then released it to the public with little testing and then get surprised that it was doing this like the author suggests happened.

They need a team of people to not use it but try to break it. I'm as suprised.

Re: Yishan Wong: "Google's Gemini issue is not about woke/DEI"

#26

My personal opinion is that what he says is non-sense divagation. The problem of woke instructions like this is that it goes against the physical reality of the dataset. And it is the physical reality that does that we have what we have even if we don't like it. Such a case better show us the issue with the woke mindset that tries to bend the reality. You might want to ask the AI to only generate positive opinion, me…

The article addresses this very point, using the example of climate change:

> it will be VERY plausible for an AI to simply conclude that it should proceed with the most expedient way to delete ~95% of humans.

The elimination of ~95% of humans is a realistic way of "solving" climate change, without bending reality. It just so happens that this is not a morally acceptable solution to most of us. In other words, it is not an issue of people bending reality, it is an issue of the reality being far more complicated than humans programmers can fathom, and consequently, that humans programming an AI to address real issues will be inherently limited by their own imagination of what the solutions to those issue most might be.

In other words, woke programmers may be bending reality due to their biases and limitations, leading to unacceptable outcomes from their AI, but don't be so arrogant as to think that your own biases and limitations aren't going to yield equally unacceptable output.

Re: Yishan Wong: "Google's Gemini issue is not about woke/DEI"

#27
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There used to be alternative websites that would turn a tweet thread into a single webpage (note that this is not what nitter did), but I don't know if they stopped working too?

As parent says, nitter is dead. Discussion at the time: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39382590

I wasn't talking about nitter, I'm talking about websites with names like "threadapp" or similar that would just convert a single thread into a static webpage.

Re: Yishan Wong: "Google's Gemini issue is not about woke/DEI"

#29
I wonder if we will eventually get a chat agent that just has a slider for "wokeness". Possibly using something like this "Representation Engineering":

https://vgel.me/posts/representation-engineering/

Just as a thought experiment, project that to the hypothetical existential risk scenario. Maybe there is a slider for aggression (hopefully not) or literalness of interpretation of instructions.

Post reply on HN