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USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

uscis.gov

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Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#21

Post by next_xibalba »

jedberg wrote: post #4

It seems like it would be so easy to fix the H1-B program but no one wants to and I feel like I must be missing something. The purpose of the H1-B is to allow companies to hire foreigners with special skills that can't be found amongst US citizens. So why not just grant H1-Bs to the companies that are willing to pay their talent the most? Let any company apply and list a salary which they have to agree to pay for at…

The fact that the U.S. immigration system is so obviously broken is the topic on which I am most vulnerable to conspiracy theories. It just makes no sense. From the Southern border to H1-B, it looks designed to anger and disappoint every single stakeholder (excepting the businesses who employ illegal immigrants for poor wages).

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#22

Post by nrmitchi »

jedberg wrote: post #4

It seems like it would be so easy to fix the H1-B program but no one wants to and I feel like I must be missing something. The purpose of the H1-B is to allow companies to hire foreigners with special skills that can't be found amongst US citizens. So why not just grant H1-Bs to the companies that are willing to pay their talent the most? Let any company apply and list a salary which they have to agree to pay for at…

It’s because the positions that talent may not exist for (but is needed) isn’t necessarily as profitable (and can’t pay as much) as other industries under the same program.

Basing on salary alone would mean ~100% of visas go to tech talent in major cities, and every other profession is cast aside.

That’s not to say that ranking based on salary within an industry wouldn’t be a potential improvement. Or modifying caps to be industry based. There are definitely options here that could be a bit more surgical.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#23

Post by BobaFloutist »

jedberg wrote: post #7
dheera wrote: post #2

I find the entire H-1B program somewhat ridiculously designed. 0. There should be no cap for people who have received higher education degrees in the US. What's the point of educating people and equipping them with everything they need to be successful in the US, advance the US (including creating lots of jobs) and then deporting them right after? 1. There should be no cap for people who are going into STEM, AI, or o…

> There should be no cap for people who have received higher education degrees in the US. Agree 100%. Student visas should convert to work visas automatically on graduation from an accredited institution and be good for at least five years.

And work visas should have built-in naturalization paths. There's no reason a highly educated, highly contributing member of society for the past 5-10 years should risk deportation if they get laid off, or, god forbid, quit due to working conditions.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#25

Post by tomrod »

jedberg wrote: post #4

It seems like it would be so easy to fix the H1-B program but no one wants to and I feel like I must be missing something. The purpose of the H1-B is to allow companies to hire foreigners with special skills that can't be found amongst US citizens. So why not just grant H1-Bs to the companies that are willing to pay their talent the most? Let any company apply and list a salary which they have to agree to pay for at…

Some pushback on your logic chain:

> foreigners with special skills that can't be found amongst US citizens

This is honestly rare, unless you couple it with a wage level that is lower than the domestic market will bear. Some individuals involved in R&D, but outside of that there are few skills that are not found in the US. I believe the condition isn't not found, but rather, in low supply?

> make the visa transferrable if another company wants to take it over after say the first two years at the same or better salary.

This would be a huge boon.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#26

Post by lolinder »

vsskanth wrote: post #6

> the registration fee during the registration period starting in March 2024, will remain $10. Yeah, every single outsourcing provider is going to enter all their employees and market whoever is selected for on-site assignments to their customers. The cost of entry is way too low and this attracts frivolous registrations. Previously, it used to cost thousands of dollars before to prepare a full petition and only thos…

That fee has been $10 all along—see this from last year [0]. I don't know much about this process, but the thousands of dollars must be coming from something else—probably some combination of other government fees and attorney bills.

[0] https://www.uscis.gov/working-in-the-united-states/temporary...

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#27

Post by olliej »

Oh, so this looks like it's correcting for that thing where companies were essentially using multiple contracting companies to all apply for a visa for the same person? e.g. double (triple? n-ary?) dipping in the lotto?

I still think a lot of the more wanton abuses in the H1-B system could be resolved by requiring the employee be a direct employee of the company they're actually working for (e.g. you can't get a contracting company to provide you with engineers), and to require compensation be - say - a minimum of say 20% above the average wage for the job they're doing, relative to other employees at the company, other workers doing manifestly similar jobs in the same geographical area, etc.

If nothing else this will apply upwards pressure on wages even in shitty "we're abusing the h1-b process" contracting companies, because every new h1-b employee they have necessarily increases the average wage at that company, which increases the minimum wage for the next h1-b, etc. The reality is that the set up of the h1-b program allows employers to abuse h1-b employees with relative impunity (including notably lowering wages), so a mechanism by which simply increasing the number of h1-b employees you have forces the wages up counters their ability to use h1-b supported abusive practices to undercut local workers.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#28

Post by karmasimida »

jedberg wrote: post #4

It seems like it would be so easy to fix the H1-B program but no one wants to and I feel like I must be missing something. The purpose of the H1-B is to allow companies to hire foreigners with special skills that can't be found amongst US citizens. So why not just grant H1-Bs to the companies that are willing to pay their talent the most? Let any company apply and list a salary which they have to agree to pay for at…

> So why not just grant H1-Bs to the companies that are willing to pay their talent the most?

Because industries pay differently. Unless you argue H1Bs all go to big techs.

The problem with H1B program is, no matter how it is structured, it WILL be gamed.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#29

Post by 0xcde4c3db »

jedberg wrote: post #4

It seems like it would be so easy to fix the H1-B program but no one wants to and I feel like I must be missing something. The purpose of the H1-B is to allow companies to hire foreigners with special skills that can't be found amongst US citizens. So why not just grant H1-Bs to the companies that are willing to pay their talent the most? Let any company apply and list a salary which they have to agree to pay for at…

The thing you're "missing" is that it absolutely is, in practice, about laundering low-wage foreign labor. It's not actually complicated. It's obfuscation of exploitation. Same as it ever was. You're just not supposed to believe that your country is doing that.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#30

Post by ra7 »

CPLX wrote: post #5
dheera wrote: post #2

I find the entire H-1B program somewhat ridiculously designed. 0. There should be no cap for people who have received higher education degrees in the US. What's the point of educating people and equipping them with everything they need to be successful in the US, advance the US (including creating lots of jobs) and then deporting them right after? 1. There should be no cap for people who are going into STEM, AI, or o…

> There should be no cap for people who have received higher education degrees in the US. This has the effect of delegating decisions about who enters the country to an unelected and unaccountable group of admissions officers working at private institutions.

Students only get a visa after getting interviewed by a visa officer at a U.S. embassy/consulate. So they've already been vetted by a government official.
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