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Two physicists who correctly predicted the mass of Higgs boson [video]

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Re: Two physicists who correctly predicted the mass of Higgs boson [video]

#21

Post by mr_mitm »

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #14
mr_mitm wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which position? In the video she simply embedded an interesting anecdote into textbook knowledge. Don't know what the flagged comment said though.

The one that she articulates at 7:10 onwards in the video. Starting with "What does this all means? it means that Quantum gravity just might..."

The position is: quantum gravity might not be that big of a mysterious problem as most physicist make it out to be so they would rather ignore that prediction by Wetterich.

That's it, that's the entire position. I don't know, that's not a lot of substance to work with. I don't think it's a particular controversial stance. It does fit very well into her "I'm not like the other physicists" shtick, though.

Re: Two physicists who correctly predicted the mass of Higgs boson [video]

#22

Post by SideburnsOfDoom »

Qwertious wrote: post #11
pclmulqdq wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

She is a physicist who is not into string theory or dark matter, which is definitely more controversial of a position within the physics community than outside.

She also made a video on capitalism, which was politically controversial (obviously) but also made several blatantly, objectively wrong claims that were based on no research whatsoever (cough barter economy cough).

It's a good idea to not listen to Physicists talking about Economics, or Economists on Physics either.

An even better idea would be people not producing these "authoritative-seeming hot takes outside of their field of expertise" in the first place though.

Re: Two physicists who correctly predicted the mass of Higgs boson [video]

#23

Post by bmitc »

bawolff wrote: post #19
Qwertious wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

She also made a video on capitalism, which was politically controversial (obviously) but also made several blatantly, objectively wrong claims that were based on no research whatsoever (cough barter economy cough).

Most people have bad takes outside of their field of expertise. I haven't seen her video on capitalism, but honestly no matter how horrible it is, i doubt it would change my view on her videos on physics.

I think, more often than not, those people are scientists and engineers, and physicists seem to be the most willing to do so.

Re: Two physicists who correctly predicted the mass of Higgs boson [video]

#24

Post by avpix »

Like most pop-sci, there's enough nuance to be found in the papers to tell its own story. I wasn't familiar with the Shaposhnikov and Wetterich paper, or asymptotic safety in general, and that 126 GeV Higgs mass prediction is the best I've seen. Their paper ends with "Detecting the Higgs scalar with mass around 126 GeV at the LHC could give a strong hint for the absence of new physics influencing the running of the SM couplings between the Fermi and Planck/unification scales" which seems surprisingly prescient after a decade of null results from the LHC. So why is this ignored in mainstream (aka not youtube) physics?

Well, a quick search on InspireHEP shows a 2019 paper [1] that adds on Shaposhnikov and Wtterich's. Of note is that an updated top mass value changes the Higgs mass prediction to 132 GeV, rather in tension with 125 GeV. (The paper then cleverly tries to extend the Standard Model to adjust the prediction back to the measured Higgs mass.) The original argument doesn't look like such a slam dunk anymore.

[1] Kwapisz, "Asymptotic safety, the Higgs mass and beyond the Standard Model physics"

Re: Two physicists who correctly predicted the mass of Higgs boson [video]

#25

Post by bazoom42 »

kragen wrote: post #13
saagarjha wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many that are worth listening to are controversial. But many that are controversial are not worth listening to. Which is which is a hard question to answer :)

yes, but this means that if you divide people into those with controversial opinions, and those without, you should direct 100% of your listening to the first group. at some point you will have to be more selective than that, but that's clearly the first step

This is how you become a flat-earther.

Re: Two physicists who correctly predicted the mass of Higgs boson [video]

#26

Post by SideburnsOfDoom »

mr_mitm wrote: post #21
SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The one that she articulates at 7:10 onwards in the video. Starting with "What does this all means? it means that Quantum gravity just might..."

The position is: quantum gravity might not be that big of a mysterious problem as most physicist make it out to be so they would rather ignore that prediction by Wetterich. That's it, that's the entire position. I don't know, that's not a lot of substance to work with. I don't think it's a particular controversial stance. It does fit very well into her "I'm not like the other physicists" shtick, though.

> That's it, that's the entire position ... that's not a lot of substance

With reference to 2 specific papers, one by Weinberg, the other by Shaposhnikov and Wetterich; which she claims are overlooked; and the correct prediction in the second paper. Is that not a little more substance?

Re: Two physicists who correctly predicted the mass of Higgs boson [video]

#27

Post by bawolff »

bmitc wrote: post #20
Joel_Mckay wrote: post #10

“My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those who do the work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the first group; there was much less competition there.” (Indira Gandhi)

I think I actually disagree with Gandhi here. Lol. There are a lot of people that do the work. The numbers of those who take the credit are much less. However, there is usually a power imbalance that yields to their ability to do so. So it's not about numbers. It's about power.

I think that's still consistent though. Lots of people try to take credit, only a few succeed. There is no shortage of work to be done, so there is enough room for everyone to do work.

Re: Two physicists who correctly predicted the mass of Higgs boson [video]

#28

Post by babypuncher »

bmitc wrote: post #20
Joel_Mckay wrote: post #10

“My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those who do the work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the first group; there was much less competition there.” (Indira Gandhi)

I think I actually disagree with Gandhi here. Lol. There are a lot of people that do the work. The numbers of those who take the credit are much less. However, there is usually a power imbalance that yields to their ability to do so. So it's not about numbers. It's about power.

For every Elon Musk there are hundreds or even thousands of engineers with actual degrees and experience relevant to the thing that was built.

Re: Two physicists who correctly predicted the mass of Higgs boson [video]

#29

Post by nostromo »

bawolff wrote: post #19
Qwertious wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

She also made a video on capitalism, which was politically controversial (obviously) but also made several blatantly, objectively wrong claims that were based on no research whatsoever (cough barter economy cough).

Most people have bad takes outside of their field of expertise. I haven't seen her video on capitalism, but honestly no matter how horrible it is, i doubt it would change my view on her videos on physics.

Her take on capitalism is in line what most economists think though. It was only controversial amongst people outside of that field.

Re: Two physicists who correctly predicted the mass of Higgs boson [video]

#30

Post by readthenotes1 »

bmitc wrote: post #20
Joel_Mckay wrote: post #10

“My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those who do the work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the first group; there was much less competition there.” (Indira Gandhi)

I think I actually disagree with Gandhi here. Lol. There are a lot of people that do the work. The numbers of those who take the credit are much less. However, there is usually a power imbalance that yields to their ability to do so. So it's not about numbers. It's about power.

Ghandi did not say half the people do the work and half the people take the credit, which is what it sounds like your disagreement is with.

And of course, many binary segmentations work well for most cases and fail in unusual cases that can generally ignored.

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