Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders • Hacker News Board

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#21

Post by fzeroracer » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 1:00 PM UTC

nottorp wrote: post #6

gbrindisi wrote: post #2

how bad of a housing crisis is in the netherlands? Wherever I look in europe there is a housing crisis for a reason or another.

The one dutch guy I know that bought a house bought it in ... Belgium. Rents are horrendous. House prices the same. The problem is kicking out those dirty foreigners who sweep your streets and raise rent prices won't lower rents. At best they will plateau for a little while.

They aren't even kicking out all of the foreigners. He specifically wants to kick out all 'non-western' foreigners which is already a fraction of a fraction of the people who immigrate to the Netherlands. It's just red meat to racists who want to divert the problem away from things that are harder to solve to something that's easier and gets you voted in.

I imagine things will go down the same way as it did in the UK.

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#22

Post by newyankee » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 1:00 PM UTC

misja111 wrote: post #16

Weird to read a post here from a foreign newspaper trying to describe what happened in my own country. But largely it's true, many people are unhappy with the amount of migration, the housing crisis, the rising cost of living and also what they feel is too much environmentalism. They feel that the parties that were in the government during the last 10 years did not take their concerns seriously or even made them wors…

Canada is not at all a crowded country, yet it has housing crisis. At least Netherlands had the foresight to create dense, urban spaces with cycling infrastructure and half decent public transit. All they need to do now is replicate this. The thing about environmental concerns is that the nos should be balanced with human quality of life, and in that lens the Dutch way really works better than many other developed countries.

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#23

Post by maeil » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 1:00 PM UTC

gbrindisi wrote: post #2

how bad of a housing crisis is in the netherlands? Wherever I look in europe there is a housing crisis for a reason or another.

The worst in Europe, and since much longer than any other country in Europe.

It's common for Dutch universities to only accept international students on the condition that they (i.e. the student) manage to find housing themselves, because there have been many cases where they enrolled but just couldn't get housing anywhere. You don't see that in other countries.

And it's been this bad for more than a decade.

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#24

Post by tgv » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 1:01 PM UTC

underseacables wrote: post #3

When you look at the electorate of the PVV in general, it consists of people who experience more difficulties to get by. They are more lonely... Sounds rather condescending. I don't like it when armchair experts place such subjective labels on people. "Lonely, less intelligent," etc. It's second guessing a persons vote which is a tacit way of undermining that vote. Rather they should analyze policy and try to underst…

> Sounds rather condescending.

It is, and it isn't really true either.

* 17 procent aged 18-34 voted PVV against 7 procent in the previous elections.

* 10 procent of people with a higher education voted PVV.

* PVV won country-side, but also in coties.

* M/F ratio is 53-47.

Source: NRC, 25-11-2023

Also: "difficulties to get by" should have been left-wing parties' priorities, but just one of them has been campaigning on that consistently (although they lost again in these elections).

> a tacit way of undermining that vote.

It has "deplorables" written all over it. While I don't pretend to have the answers, The Guardian is trying to solve the problem by sticking fingers in their ears and shouting "na na na na na, I can't hear you".

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#25

Post by ChatGTP » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 1:01 PM UTC

misja111 wrote: post #16

Weird to read a post here from a foreign newspaper trying to describe what happened in my own country. But largely it's true, many people are unhappy with the amount of migration, the housing crisis, the rising cost of living and also what they feel is too much environmentalism. They feel that the parties that were in the government during the last 10 years did not take their concerns seriously or even made them wors…

PVV proposes to stop all immigration

Is there a documented case in history where this has been beneficial ? Not attacking you btw, I'm actually wondering if anyone has known this to be effective?

Immigrants seem like a token thing to get angry about when the chips are down and the country is mismanaged.

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#26

Post by 5437553 » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 1:01 PM UTC

misja111 wrote: post #16

Weird to read a post here from a foreign newspaper trying to describe what happened in my own country. But largely it's true, many people are unhappy with the amount of migration, the housing crisis, the rising cost of living and also what they feel is too much environmentalism. They feel that the parties that were in the government during the last 10 years did not take their concerns seriously or even made them wors…

[flagged]

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#27

Post by selfmodruntime » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 1:02 PM UTC

misja111 wrote: post #16

Weird to read a post here from a foreign newspaper trying to describe what happened in my own country. But largely it's true, many people are unhappy with the amount of migration, the housing crisis, the rising cost of living and also what they feel is too much environmentalism. They feel that the parties that were in the government during the last 10 years did not take their concerns seriously or even made them wors…

> part from the economic problems that this might cause, it is simply not possible due to EU legislation

This is definitely untrue as countries like Poland show well enough. You do not need to stick to every EU rule, you just need to be well off enough to pay off your fines.

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#28

Post by alistairSH » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 1:02 PM UTC

wodenokoto wrote: post #10

Garvi wrote: post #4

[flagged]

What does bright shade of yellow mean?

He’s referring to “yellow journalism”. A mostly American term, used to describe the Pulitzer vs Hearst era in NY in the late 1800s.

Roughly equivalent to tabloid journalism in the UK. Although the newspapers of the era did serious reporting as well.

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#29

Post by 5437553 » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 1:03 PM UTC

ChatGTP wrote: post #25

misja111 wrote: post #16

Weird to read a post here from a foreign newspaper trying to describe what happened in my own country. But largely it's true, many people are unhappy with the amount of migration, the housing crisis, the rising cost of living and also what they feel is too much environmentalism. They feel that the parties that were in the government during the last 10 years did not take their concerns seriously or even made them wors…

PVV proposes to stop all immigration Is there a documented case in history where this has been beneficial ? Not attacking you btw, I'm actually wondering if anyone has known this to be effective? Immigrants seem like a token thing to get angry about when the chips are down and the country is mismanaged.

[flagged]

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#30

Post by selfmodruntime » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 1:03 PM UTC

ChatGTP wrote: post #25

misja111 wrote: post #16

Weird to read a post here from a foreign newspaper trying to describe what happened in my own country. But largely it's true, many people are unhappy with the amount of migration, the housing crisis, the rising cost of living and also what they feel is too much environmentalism. They feel that the parties that were in the government during the last 10 years did not take their concerns seriously or even made them wors…

PVV proposes to stop all immigration Is there a documented case in history where this has been beneficial ? Not attacking you btw, I'm actually wondering if anyone has known this to be effective? Immigrants seem like a token thing to get angry about when the chips are down and the country is mismanaged.

Poland.

> Immigrants seem like a token thing to get angry about when the chips are down and the country is mismanaged.

This has been the primary opinion of center to leftleaning parties for a decade now. There are very real problems with immigration, even more so if a large part of immigration consists of migrations of cultures that are incompatible with western ideas.