Earlier quoted context omitted.
Are you just mad that the Montreal Protocol worked?
[flagged]
What's it like to have a worldview that is decoupled from all physical evidence?
Ozone hole goes large again
21–30 of 116 posts
Re: Ozone hole goes large again
#22Earlier quoted context omitted.
This will make skin cancers slightly more prevalent in southern latitudes but I can’t see any other changes that aren’t marginal. It isn’t great but we are not “fucked” by any means.
[flagged]
> We deserve to burn.
As quite a bit of a doomer myself, I think this attitude is extremely dangerous and really an incorrect view of the situation. Blame is inevitable when facing despair, but I think it's not a great idea to turn this into an issue about blaming yourself or others.
Human beings are terrible at long term risk/reward reasoning. But this is a pretty expected consequence of any evolved species. There is zero pressure in the evolutionary system to encourage a species to develop the ability to both reason about very long term events, and act on them. Evolutionary forces just don't respond to things on this time scale.
Climate change has always had the problem that the easier it was to solve, the more uncertain we were about it's effects. In 1900 we could have easily just stopped progressing, learned to become sustainable and avoided climate change at very little cost. But how would anyone seriously believe and be concerned about an existential threat to their great, great grandchildren?
As the existential risk of climate change becomes more obvious, the cost to avoid it increases dramatically. There is no stopping climate change now, and even limiting its impact (which we can always do) would require a massive disruption to our way of life. We're fighting wars right now to access more fossil fuels, we aren't ready to seriously start keeping them in the ground.
Our tragedy as a species is that we can see how to avoid climate change but are unable to act on it by our nature. If anything us all being "fucked" should evoke a sense of pathos. We're no different than any other living organism exposed to sources of non-renewable, cheap, high density energy. The yeast that die making the alcohol in our beer suffer the same local climate catastrophe as we will.
Re: Ozone hole goes large again
#23[flagged]
It didn't just go away GDI. We figured out what the problem was and fixed it. You've heard of science before?
Re: Ozone hole goes large again
#24It got flagged, but there was a fair bit of discussion and comments: [flagged] The ozone hole above Antarctica has grown to three times the size of Brazil https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37793941
The snippet from the top comment is worth reposting:
> Yet despite experiencing large seasonal growth this year, the ozone hole is still decreasing in size overall. "Based on the Montreal Protocol and the decrease of anthropogenic ozone-depleting substances, scientists currently predict that the global ozone layer will reach its normal state again by around 2050," said Claus Zehner, ESA's mission manager for Copernicus Sentinel-5P.
Re: Ozone hole goes large again
#25Earlier quoted context omitted.
This will make skin cancers slightly more prevalent in southern latitudes but I can’t see any other changes that aren’t marginal. It isn’t great but we are not “fucked” by any means.
No, but we are fucked from climate change.
Nah, people will just buy more A/Cs. But the ecosystem collapse will do us in.
Re: Ozone hole goes large again
#26Earlier quoted context omitted.
“The eruption of the Hunga Tonga volcano in January 2022 injected a lot of water vapour into the stratosphere which only reached the south polar regions after the end of the 2022 ozone hole. “The water vapour could have led to the heightened formation of polar stratospheric clouds, where chlorofluorocarbons (CFCs) can react and accelerate ozone depletion. The presence of water vapour may also contribute to the coolin…
Personally I suspect someone is cheating on their emissions, or using something that's a bit cheaper but is ozone damaging in some process.
Its pretty well documented someone is producing cfcs.
Re: Ozone hole goes large again
#27Earlier quoted context omitted.
This will make skin cancers slightly more prevalent in southern latitudes but I can’t see any other changes that aren’t marginal. It isn’t great but we are not “fucked” by any means.
No, but we are fucked from climate change.
Again I disagree. The worst predictions for climate change are not based on very solid models. There are lots of clever people who are skeptical of the doomerism.
As an example, the claim that more people will die from heat waves is correct, but when you compare it to the people who won’t die from cold weather then climate change is a net benefit!
And in terms of environmental collapses, things like the health of ocean ecosystems is more dependent on human activities like overfishing. Focusing on climate change to fix these problems is nonsensical.
Re: Ozone hole goes large again
#28Earlier quoted context omitted.
[flagged]
What's it like to have a worldview that is decoupled from all physical evidence?
If you're kind, unconsciously avoiding something scary. If you're not, unconsciously avoiding something scary while thinking that you are smarter than the rest.
Re: Ozone hole goes large again
#29Earlier quoted context omitted.
[flagged]
> We deserve to burn. As quite a bit of a doomer myself, I think this attitude is extremely dangerous and really an incorrect view of the situation. Blame is inevitable when facing despair, but I think it's not a great idea to turn this into an issue about blaming yourself or others. Human beings are terrible at long term risk/reward reasoning. But this is a pretty expected consequence of any evolved species. There i…
> We're no different than any other living organism exposed to sources of non-renewable, cheap, high density energy.
But we have money, the only thing we really care about.
We live on a rich rock but for some reason, the whole planet is bankrupt. It's like if we got stolen by our ancestors and we dumbasses like to keep this tradition alive, maybe hoping that we will, us individually, one day, get richer than the guy next door, and feel superior, and maybe, happy.
Re: Ozone hole goes large again
#30Wasn't there a story about satellite imagery detecting massive CFC releases in China from expandable foam?
Edit: found one...
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/23/china-factorie...