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What SWE job hunting is like right now

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Re: What SWE job hunting is like right now

#21
There is a lot in your comment to unpack, so I hope this is helpful:

1. Yes, there is an industry-wide downturn in tech. There was just massive over-hiring during the pandemic, and then a huge number of layoffs, which means there are tons of people on the market. Many people have been reporting a strong shift in mentality, lead times, etc. in the tech job market.

2. There is, however, still a lot of demand for tech workers, even if still less than the ZIRP years. Many companies and institutions simply couldn't compete with high paying FAANGs and startups for tech talent, but their need to tech work didn't go away. So in places like government, consumer-focused companies, non-profits, etc. are still hiring. Salaries are often considerably lower than pure tech companies.

3. Despite the huge number of remote jobs, location still matters, primarily because relationships still matter, and those are easier to build face-to-face. This is not unique to tech. If you want to make it big in the fashion industry, there are maybe 4 -ish cities worldwide where you should live. Movie-making, pretty obvious. So while tech is just an overall much, much larger industry, it's not surprising you're disillusioned by St. Louis.

You say that you're a contractor. What does this mean exactly? I.e. are you a contractor by choice, or would you prefer a full time job? How do you normally find jobs (is there a recruiter you usually work with, do you do your own searching, get jobs from past contacts, etc.)? The answer to these questions is important when it comes to optimizing your job search.

Re: What SWE job hunting is like right now

#23
post #16

As a hiring manager for a relatively small company, a major problem is misaligned salary expectations. Real world example: I recently interviewed an engineer hit by layoffs at Shopify/UPS. The candidate had 4 years of total work experience, and was making $175k in the role that she was let go from, and they won’t accept anything less when looking for a new role. With 4 years of total experience in the workforce. I wo…

4 years experience at 140k is an insult IMHO. You claim you can easily find ppl w 5+ years experience, but I find that claim dubious. What you're willing to pay and what value we add seem to be vastly different.

Re: What SWE job hunting is like right now

#24
post #16

As a hiring manager for a relatively small company, a major problem is misaligned salary expectations. Real world example: I recently interviewed an engineer hit by layoffs at Shopify/UPS. The candidate had 4 years of total work experience, and was making $175k in the role that she was let go from, and they won’t accept anything less when looking for a new role. With 4 years of total experience in the workforce. I wo…

> It’s a tough pill to swallow but it is possible to get offers, but they might not be at the salary levels from 2-3 years ago.

This goes both ways. People teams will prefer to pay less than they have before, and engineers should usually ask for more than they currently make.

Anecdotally as a hiring manager, I would always encourage folks to have savings to cover the time it takes to avoid settling for lower salaries if they lose their role. The folks not making that much already should be moving up to those “lower paying” positions.

Re: What SWE job hunting is like right now

#25
post #16

As a hiring manager for a relatively small company, a major problem is misaligned salary expectations. Real world example: I recently interviewed an engineer hit by layoffs at Shopify/UPS. The candidate had 4 years of total work experience, and was making $175k in the role that she was let go from, and they won’t accept anything less when looking for a new role. With 4 years of total experience in the workforce. I wo…

4 years experience at 140k is an insult IMHO. You claim you can easily find ppl w 5+ years experience, but I find that claim dubious. What you're willing to pay and what value we add seem to be vastly different.

I can’t argue with your viewpoint.

All I can say is there are a lot of people with 10-15 yrs experience who will happily accept $140-150k with 10+ yrs experience in the US remote market (more specifically full stack node/react)

Re: What SWE job hunting is like right now

#26
post #16

As a hiring manager for a relatively small company, a major problem is misaligned salary expectations. Real world example: I recently interviewed an engineer hit by layoffs at Shopify/UPS. The candidate had 4 years of total work experience, and was making $175k in the role that she was let go from, and they won’t accept anything less when looking for a new role. With 4 years of total experience in the workforce. I wo…

120k is bottom of the barrel wages.

Re: What SWE job hunting is like right now

#28
post #16

As a hiring manager for a relatively small company, a major problem is misaligned salary expectations. Real world example: I recently interviewed an engineer hit by layoffs at Shopify/UPS. The candidate had 4 years of total work experience, and was making $175k in the role that she was let go from, and they won’t accept anything less when looking for a new role. With 4 years of total experience in the workforce. I wo…

> I would have loved to hire them at $120-140k, but for $175k I can easily find people with 5x more years of experience.

Where are you easily finding someone with 20 years experience for 175k?

Re: What SWE job hunting is like right now

#30
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

4 years experience at 140k is an insult IMHO. You claim you can easily find ppl w 5+ years experience, but I find that claim dubious. What you're willing to pay and what value we add seem to be vastly different.

I can’t argue with your viewpoint. All I can say is there are a lot of people with 10-15 yrs experience who will happily accept $140-150k with 10+ yrs experience in the US remote market (more specifically full stack node/react)

I will change my opinion if you can provide evidence beyond anecdotes. Honestly, it helpful information if it's backed up my facts.
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