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We don't have senior engineers anymore

sibelius.substack.com

21–30 of 127 posts

Re: We don't have senior engineers anymore

#21

Any article that splits people into two groups and says one group cannot inherently be good at something immediately puts me off, sorry.

So you are saying there are those who split people into two groups and those two do not, and the first group is inherently bad at writing articles?

Re: We don't have senior engineers anymore

#22
post #15
post #11

This is what happens when anyone with a JS book and 6 months of time can call themselves an engineer.

would it change anything if they called themselves developers instead?

Yes. They could be "Senior Developers" in the same way "Paramedics" are not "Doctors'

Re: We don't have senior engineers anymore

#23
I respect some of what’s being said about “mappers” vs “packers” - but the article presents the idea that there are 2 kinds of programmer and you’re one or the other, largely based on growth as a “real” mapper.

I think a more realistic description is that everyone is a mapper. There isn’t a single body of knowledge that is “software engineering” - so it’s ok to encounter something new, “pack” it, then map it if it’s valuable.

Far better to encourage mapping than create false dichotomies that can easily work their way into cultural fit interviews.

“The candidate failed to find an obscure error in the JS console… clearly a packer - no hire”.

Re: We don't have senior engineers anymore

#24

Wait till they end up as staff or principal. Along with bad management they hollow out several hundred person orgs.

all titles except for the ones indicating executive or direct reports are meaningless. It is a game, where workers strife to be granted higher and higher titles, just because their peers and the industry does. There is no inherit requirements, I can start a company today and call everyone super duper staff engineer

They're not meaningless. Someone can get a line management role and be terrible technically. In fact that's a good thing to do with someone who's not good technically.

Re: We don't have senior engineers anymore

#26
post #11

This is what happens when anyone with a JS book and 6 months of time can call themselves an engineer.

JS boot camp is more like it.

A book would probably require enough self motivation that you might get a decent candidate.

These boot camps are churning out mediocre JS devs like they’re going out of style. Personally I won’t even look at the resume of a single one anymore. I’ve told our recruiter to not send me ANY resumes from boot campers.

Re: We don't have senior engineers anymore

#28

In all the companies I work for in the last 20 years "senior engineer" effectively meant someone with about 5 years of experience. In general the bar is low, indeed, and the title tends to be quite aggrandizing. The title that shows seniority ("been there, done that"), again in my experience, is the next one, which usually is "principal engineer".

It’s a bit of a shame that senior titles are being tossed out like candy now, while I had to work my ass off to get there. It took me 16 years, which feels about right to me. I switched my career from systems engineering to network engineering in 2010 so I might have gotten there sooner. (IT jobs for college grads in 2004 were few and far in between in my area and I had to take what I could get.)

Re: We don't have senior engineers anymore

#29
post #22
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

would it change anything if they called themselves developers instead?

Yes. They could be "Senior Developers" in the same way "Paramedics" are not "Doctors'

I come from a country where the title "engineer" is legally protected and needs to be issued by an accredited school.

This had zero impact on software developers careers or salary, except if you wish to work for the government.

Re: We don't have senior engineers anymore

#30

In all the companies I work for in the last 20 years "senior engineer" effectively meant someone with about 5 years of experience. In general the bar is low, indeed, and the title tends to be quite aggrandizing. The title that shows seniority ("been there, done that"), again in my experience, is the next one, which usually is "principal engineer".

But now you’re just moving the goalposts and inevitably someone else will make the same declaration about principal engineers and will instead insist that only Chief Architects (or whatever next step up the corporate ladder of madness is) are the really truly experienced class of engineers.

It’s a pointless challenge to try and bucket engineers by skill levels like that. Titles are for compensation and rank, and nothing more. A senior at my company would’ve been more like a staff engineer at my last spot. Every company is different and thats okay.

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