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We are not sustainable

frame.work

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Re: We are not sustainable

#21

Post by steve_adams_86 »

icegreentea2 wrote: post #15

The life cycle assessment shows that over a five year life span, production is responsible for 65% of CO2e, and usage about 25% (out of a total estimated 200kg - roughly 86L of gasoline) using "a typical US energy mix". Component wise (during production), the largest CO2e contributor was the display at ~25%, then the mainboard at 20%, and then battery around 15%. Take aways for me are that: from a sustainability stan…

Regarding display production: I recently bought a Studio Display from Apple with the thought that it should last a very long time.

It bricked itself with a software update after maybe 3 months. I realized these things depend on Apple supporting the A13 chip in order for it to remain compatible with new technologies and, absurdly, to remain secure from exploits. A monitor.

I couldn’t regret my purchase much more and feel pretty stupid for not figuring this stuff out before I pulled out my credit card.

To add insult to injury, the display has been getting repaired for almost 2 months and there’s still no ETA on a fix. I highly recommend looking elsewhere for a display, both for ecological reasons but also because these things likely have a software-driven expiry date, with their hardware being relatively complex and error prone compared to most displays.

Also, they come with a barely usable camera. Audio is fine but it’s mind boggling how bad the camera is. What a waste.

Re: We are not sustainable

#22

Post by tomxor »

> create products that last longer, meaning fewer new ones need to be made

Yes this is the solution, but it's hard to not feel apathetic about the whole thing - Capitalism becomes consumerism - One company can have an ethos, but ultimately sustainability is not included in the cost function of the economic model.

Framework are doing wonderful work, but in a sense (and I mean this in the most respectful way possible) there is only a subtle difference between green washing and making yourself feel better by being personally responsible and buying a framework laptop, because ultimately it doesn't fix the underlying economic and societal issues that dictate how the rest of the world operates. At best Framework can offer an example.

Re: We are not sustainable

#23

Post by gpm »

icegreentea2 wrote: post #15

The life cycle assessment shows that over a five year life span, production is responsible for 65% of CO2e, and usage about 25% (out of a total estimated 200kg - roughly 86L of gasoline) using "a typical US energy mix". Component wise (during production), the largest CO2e contributor was the display at ~25%, then the mainboard at 20%, and then battery around 15%. Take aways for me are that: from a sustainability stan…

> out of a total estimated 200kg - roughly 86L of gasoline

Five year CO2 production roughly equivalent to two tanks of gas in a honda civic.

It's not nothing, but if you're looking to reduce your CO2 footprint I'm not sure this is what I'd look towards as the low hanging fruit for just about anyone who can afford their product. For instance for most people driving less, or driving smaller vehicles, would be far more effective.

Re: We are not sustainable

#24

Post by sharkjacobs »

ewzimm wrote: post #16

If the whole tech industry generated 50 million metric tons per year, that’s about 6 kilograms per person on the planet per year, about a watermelon, and if you consider that even half of those are served by it, it’s a manageable amount of waste. The fact that it’s consolidated is a responsibility but also an opportunity to make big changes with every gain. I wish the tone here focused more on that opportunity.

> and if you consider that even half of those are served by it

Are they?

Re: We are not sustainable

#25

Post by lucb1e »

steve_adams_86 wrote: post #21
icegreentea2 wrote: post #15

The life cycle assessment shows that over a five year life span, production is responsible for 65% of CO2e, and usage about 25% (out of a total estimated 200kg - roughly 86L of gasoline) using "a typical US energy mix". Component wise (during production), the largest CO2e contributor was the display at ~25%, then the mainboard at 20%, and then battery around 15%. Take aways for me are that: from a sustainability stan…

Regarding display production: I recently bought a Studio Display from Apple with the thought that it should last a very long time. It bricked itself with a software update after maybe 3 months. I realized these things depend on Apple supporting the A13 chip in order for it to remain compatible with new technologies and, absurdly, to remain secure from exploits. A monitor. I couldn’t regret my purchase much more and f…

If you want to get rid of it, multiple months for a good-as-new product is long enough to suggest they just keep it and give you the full money back instead. Laws may be different where you live, I'm not a lawyer, but that should work

Re: We are not sustainable

#26

Post by nluken »

benatkin wrote: post #6

Meanwhile at Google, Microsoft, and Apple: Greenwash all the things! \o/ https://sustainability.google/operating-sustainably/net-zero... https://blogs.microsoft.com/blog/2020/01/16/microsoft-will-b... https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2020/07/apple-commits-to-be-1... Amazon has 2040 as a target, not sure if that says they're being more honest or it's because they deal more in physical products. https://sustainability.ab…

"We are not sustainable, and we know that, but buy our products anyway" is still greenwashing...

Re: We are not sustainable

#28

Post by vondur »

steve_adams_86 wrote: post #21
icegreentea2 wrote: post #15

The life cycle assessment shows that over a five year life span, production is responsible for 65% of CO2e, and usage about 25% (out of a total estimated 200kg - roughly 86L of gasoline) using "a typical US energy mix". Component wise (during production), the largest CO2e contributor was the display at ~25%, then the mainboard at 20%, and then battery around 15%. Take aways for me are that: from a sustainability stan…

Regarding display production: I recently bought a Studio Display from Apple with the thought that it should last a very long time. It bricked itself with a software update after maybe 3 months. I realized these things depend on Apple supporting the A13 chip in order for it to remain compatible with new technologies and, absurdly, to remain secure from exploits. A monitor. I couldn’t regret my purchase much more and f…

The Studio Display has a 1 year warranty. Absolutely take it back for a new one.

Re: We are not sustainable

#29

Post by ajayyy »

nluken wrote: post #26
benatkin wrote: post #6

Meanwhile at Google, Microsoft, and Apple: Greenwash all the things! \o/ https://sustainability.google/operating-sustainably/net-zero... https://blogs.microsoft.com/blog/2020/01/16/microsoft-will-b... https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2020/07/apple-commits-to-be-1... Amazon has 2040 as a target, not sure if that says they're being more honest or it's because they deal more in physical products. https://sustainability.ab…

"We are not sustainable, and we know that, but buy our products anyway" is still greenwashing...

They encourage people to wait to buy their product only until they aren't able to repair their current one.

Re: We are not sustainable

#30

Post by steve_adams_86 »

vondur wrote: post #28
steve_adams_86 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regarding display production: I recently bought a Studio Display from Apple with the thought that it should last a very long time. It bricked itself with a software update after maybe 3 months. I realized these things depend on Apple supporting the A13 chip in order for it to remain compatible with new technologies and, absurdly, to remain secure from exploits. A monitor. I couldn’t regret my purchase much more and f…

The Studio Display has a 1 year warranty. Absolutely take it back for a new one.

They refused to replace it for quite a while and just recently agreed to replace it, but that was a week ago. It’s been a brutal customer service experience. It got 2 new logic boards while they tried to track down the problem.

At this point I still don’t know when I’ll have a working display in my possession.

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