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AWS IPv4 Estate Now Worth $4.5B

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Re: AWS IPv4 Estate Now Worth $4.5B

#21

Post by x86x87 »

TheHappyOddish wrote: post #18
yla92 wrote: post #17

Some noob questions here. How does one buy a block of IPv4 as an individual? (If that's allowed) After you purchase it, how does it come into your possession? How do you utilize them?

Speak to the local RIR[1]. They have varying requirements, but broadly you generally need to justify your use case, multi-home (for your own AS) and pay a yearly membership fee. After that, you need to speak to your ISP about either advertising it or peering with you - or going dark fibre if you're a real masochist. Good luck, update us if you do it! 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regional_Internet_registry

Yeah usually you won't be able to buy one if you don't have your own AS

Re: AWS IPv4 Estate Now Worth $4.5B

#22

Post by throw0101b »

jedberg wrote: post #14
throw0101b wrote: post #7

IPv6 Excuse Bingo: * https://ipv6bingo.com

I don't run IPv6 on my home network. I try it about once a year, enabling it at the router (it's already enabled on my laptop). And then random stuff just doesn't work. Various websites hang, various widgets just don't load, etc. Then I turn it off and everything gets better again. I'be been too lazy to diagnose why exactly it doesn't work, I just figure it's easier to run with it off. At some point a website I reall…

> And then random stuff just doesn't work. Various websites hang, various widgets just don't load, etc. Then I turn it off and everything gets better again.

Before I switched ISPs a few weeks ago to one without IPv6, I was with an ISP with IPv6 (dual-stack) for about five years and had zero problems.

In fact it worked 'too well' initially: when I was still IPv4-only I had put a bunch of Facebook domains in my iMac's /etc/hosts file pointing to 127.0.0.1 so that all those little icons would stop loading. At some point I noticed they were back.

After some head scratching over a day or so I realized that Facebook was IPv6-enabled, and so the icons were loading because AAAA records were working. Adding ::1 for Facebook in hosts fixed things.

Re: AWS IPv4 Estate Now Worth $4.5B

#23

Post by candiddevmike »

yla92 wrote: post #17

Some noob questions here. How does one buy a block of IPv4 as an individual? (If that's allowed) After you purchase it, how does it come into your possession? How do you utilize them?

1. You most likely can't. You typically need to prove to a numbering authority that you need that many IPs (minimum /24) for X reason and you will be multihomed (connected to two+ ISPs) by Y date.

2. You are assigned a BGP Autonomous System Number (ASN) as part of the process. The IPs are assigned to your ASN.

3. You sign a peering contract with ISPs and peer with them using BGP on your router. You use your ASN to announce your block to have traffic routed to/from your router.

One of the tragedies of IPv6, IMO, is not having a better/streamlined process for end users to get allocations without all the red tape. There's tons of space, let's pretend it's the 90s and give away IP blocks to whoever asks. Either require ISPs to give static allocations or make it easier for getting a personal block. No, prefix delegation is not good enough.

Re: AWS IPv4 Estate Now Worth $4.5B

#24

Post by atyvr »

yla92 wrote: post #17

Some noob questions here. How does one buy a block of IPv4 as an individual? (If that's allowed) After you purchase it, how does it come into your possession? How do you utilize them?

You'll need to become a member of one of the regional Internet route registries, like RIPE or ARIN. Then you can buy, say a /24, and transfer it into your RIPE/ARIN account. Now you have your own IPv4 range. And you can start for example start to use it for your own servers. To do so you need to "announce" this new /24 to the internet, using a protocol known as BGP. You can do that yourself, using a router, assuming you have an Autonomous system number (AS). You can get these via RIPE or ARIN as well. Or rely on your hosting provider to do that. For example AWS support "bring your own IP address". In that case they will announce the ip prefix in BGP for you, and you can assign your ec2 instances public IP's out of your range. Equinix Metal, (previously Packet), also makes it easy to do this.

Re: AWS IPv4 Estate Now Worth $4.5B

#25

Post by fanf2 »

Narkov wrote: post #6

A subtle detail from the article is that address prices peaked in 2021 at $60 and has steadily decreased to $35. Where does it go from here? Is this a proxy for the tech correction?

Possibly. It might also have been a bit of a panic because RIPE ran out of IPv4 addresses around that time and it was unclear back then how liquid the transfer market would be.

Re: AWS IPv4 Estate Now Worth $4.5B

#26

Post by jandrese »

jedberg wrote: post #14
throw0101b wrote: post #7

IPv6 Excuse Bingo: * https://ipv6bingo.com

I don't run IPv6 on my home network. I try it about once a year, enabling it at the router (it's already enabled on my laptop). And then random stuff just doesn't work. Various websites hang, various widgets just don't load, etc. Then I turn it off and everything gets better again. I'be been too lazy to diagnose why exactly it doesn't work, I just figure it's easier to run with it off. At some point a website I reall…

You have some misconfiguration on your local network. It's hard to tell from your description, but I'd guess maybe you don't have the firewall rules configured for IPv6 or something. Breakage is extremely rare on the live web. I can't remember the last time I found a website that was only breaking on IPv6.

Re: AWS IPv4 Estate Now Worth $4.5B

#27

Post by tryptophan »

jedberg wrote: post #14
throw0101b wrote: post #7

IPv6 Excuse Bingo: * https://ipv6bingo.com

I don't run IPv6 on my home network. I try it about once a year, enabling it at the router (it's already enabled on my laptop). And then random stuff just doesn't work. Various websites hang, various widgets just don't load, etc. Then I turn it off and everything gets better again. I'be been too lazy to diagnose why exactly it doesn't work, I just figure it's easier to run with it off. At some point a website I reall…

Debian would just not run due to apt repositories being borked if ipv6 was turned on.

Re: AWS IPv4 Estate Now Worth $4.5B

#28

Post by atyvr »

tamrix wrote: post #11

I can promise you no one is paying $35 per IPv4 address.

i disagree. skuhn posted a link to some historical data https://auctions.ipv4.global/prior-sales

Based on data from the IPv4 brokerage ipv4.global, the cost of IPv4 addresses has seen a notable increase. In 2014, the price ranged from $6 to $24 per IP, depending on the size of the subnet. By 2021, this range had jumped to between $23 and $60 per IP. The fluctuation between the lowest and highest sales prices for each IPv4 address remained relatively stable until 2021, when we began to see more significant spikes.

The peak prices for IPv4 addresses in 2021 were observed in September and October. During these months, IP addresses allocated by RIPE NCC and ARIN fetched as much as $60 each. Specifically, a /24 block from RIPE NCC sold for $15,360, while ARIN's /22 and /23 blocks went for $61,440 and $30,720, respectively.

Fast forward to October 2022, and the highest sale of the year was recorded: IP addresses allocated by ARIN sold for $60.70 each, or $15,540 for a complete /24 block. Despite these peaks, the IPv4 market appears to have reached a more stable pricing structure, especially when compared to the more volatile price shifts seen in 2021.

Re: AWS IPv4 Estate Now Worth $4.5B

#29

Post by minimaul »

jandrese wrote: post #26
jedberg wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't run IPv6 on my home network. I try it about once a year, enabling it at the router (it's already enabled on my laptop). And then random stuff just doesn't work. Various websites hang, various widgets just don't load, etc. Then I turn it off and everything gets better again. I'be been too lazy to diagnose why exactly it doesn't work, I just figure it's easier to run with it off. At some point a website I reall…

You have some misconfiguration on your local network. It's hard to tell from your description, but I'd guess maybe you don't have the firewall rules configured for IPv6 or something. Breakage is extremely rare on the live web. I can't remember the last time I found a website that was only breaking on IPv6.

The other common mistake is blocking ICMPv6 completely. This creates a really broken IPv6 stack!

edit: I've been running dual-stack with Windows, macOS, iOS & Linux for at least a decade now - I think it's closer to 20 years than 10! I've never seen it be like the parent post for my personal use, but I have seen it broken like that in places I've worked with incorrectly configured routers/firewalls.

edit 2: this isn't a good idea for v4 either, but it's less broken than v6!

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