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On Desktop GUI Minimalism

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Re: On Desktop GUI Minimalism

#21

Post by bryceneal »

colordrops wrote: post #13

Speaking of minimalist desktops, I'm really loving the unix-y philosophy behind sway/i3/hyprland/xmonad. Instead of an integrated desktop environment, you start with the simple window manager (Sway in my case), and pick and choose the tools you need for various things, such as a status bar, notifications, launcher, etc. Unless you really trick it out, there is usually very little on your screen other than the apps yo…

Interesting. I've been considering toying around with something similar using i3 and Nix. I hadn't considered binding certain applications to various workspaces, but I like that idea as well.

I'm curious if there are any particular guides/examples you would recommend, or whether your Nix config is open source somewhere?

Re: On Desktop GUI Minimalism

#22

Post by netdoll »

shric wrote: post #20
alwayslikethis wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For many people, the limiting factor of this is visual acuity though. I personally can't see it useful to have more than 2560x1440 equivalent pixels of space on a 27 inch monitor. For a larger monitor, you have to sit further back, so it is effectively the same. If you want to see more clearly, you'd need to get closer, but that causes issues since you are still limited by your available field of view.

I'd probably agree with the "useful" but I find higher resolution more aesthetically pleasing, especially text.

Conversely, I find anything above 1920x1080 very displeasing precisely because it removes my ability to practically use bitmapped fonts. Subpixel antialiasing is very distracting and Retina (IMHO) is a solution in search of a problem when it comes to making user interfaces that are actually aesthetic and easy on the eyes. I'm autistic and have diagnosed vision problems tho, so that probably feeds into it for better or worse.

Re: On Desktop GUI Minimalism

#23

Post by netdoll »

Avshalom wrote: post #19

It's a shame that rox filer is functionally dead and the rox desktop ecosystem (small as it was) is even dead-er I think author would have enjoyed it.

ROX is one of those things which is great except for the ecosystem it tied itself to. I would love to see a Wayland rewrite one day, or something using the same concepts. Or really anything that isn't r/unixporn tile rice #9001

Re: On Desktop GUI Minimalism

#24

Post by shric »

netdoll wrote: post #22
shric wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd probably agree with the "useful" but I find higher resolution more aesthetically pleasing, especially text.

Conversely, I find anything above 1920x1080 very displeasing precisely because it removes my ability to practically use bitmapped fonts. Subpixel antialiasing is very distracting and Retina (IMHO) is a solution in search of a problem when it comes to making user interfaces that are actually aesthetic and easy on the eyes. I'm autistic and have diagnosed vision problems tho, so that probably feeds into it for better o…

Fair enough and to each their own. I've been using computers since bitmapped fonts on 320x200 screens were the norm, and I've always been excited to upgrade resolution.

Re: On Desktop GUI Minimalism

#25

Post by netdoll »

Jedd wrote: post #15

> All computing up to the point of its [Apple Mac] introduction, at least from the "shell" standpoint of launching programs and managing files, was done exclusively through typing commands at the computer; you effectively had to program it, to a degree. The creators of the first Macintosh had the mouse, the desktop metaphor, and the menubar, and did their damnedest to make sure the user of their new paradigm-shifting…

> The wording has some ambiguity, but it does sound like TFA hasn't heard of Xerox or Perq - perhaps attributing some misplaced invention, rather than popularisation, to Apple.

The way I read it, they were attributing the intercombination of these elements under the desktop metaphor to Apple. Smalltalk existed, the Star existed, PERQ existed, the Lisp Machine GUIs existed and JERQ/Blit existed, but all of these were so substantially different from each other let alone what Apple did that they functionally exerted little influence on the way GUIs developed after the Macintosh launched save for a few odd branches here and there (Oberon anyone?)

Re: On Desktop GUI Minimalism

#26

Post by netdoll »

im_down_w_otp wrote: post #18
BwackNinja wrote: post #16

MacOS 9 and the spatial desktop metaphor is neat. I went that route for a while. What this misses, however, is that the biggest problem with the desktop interface is that we've substantially increased application complexity and laptops (and even smaller devices) won. As a result, we're trying to answer the question "how we fit our skeuomorphic paradigm in a diminutive form factor". The inspiration involved much large…

The 9” B&W screen on my SE/30 with a 512x384 resolution is perfectly usable for Word, Excel, IRC, and code editing. Refreshingly so at times. Comparatively it’s very distraction free. Whenever I fire it up to journal or fiddle with some classic MacOS development I always think, “Where did we manage to go so wrong in the last 30 years?”

This is where the classic Mac OS really shines: one fullscreen application which is totally dedicated to the task at hand. It's why I still favor it for many "creative" endeavors and why Apple was able to survive so relatively long with it despite the OS being a flaming garbage pile of technical debt and hacks underneath the glossy exterior.

Re: On Desktop GUI Minimalism

#27

Post by bstar77 »

Two years ago, I transitioned to a minimalist tiling window manager (WM) despite my initial reservations about them. This change was prompted by my desire to experiment with high-end hardware and a 4K multi-monitor setup in a tiled environment. Surprisingly, the switch turned out to be a game-changer, boosting my productivity significantly, with around 90% of my tasks now occurring in the terminal. Traditional criticisms of terminals, such as memorization challenges and lack of guidance, no longer apply, thanks to modern features like auto-completion, interactive history, suggestions, and plugins like Git integration. Unfortunately, the reluctance to embrace this minimalist, terminal-centric approach may hinder power users from unlocking its full potential due to long-standing biases and a fear of change.

Re: On Desktop GUI Minimalism

#28

Post by 0x445442 »

alwayslikethis wrote: post #17
BwackNinja wrote: post #16

MacOS 9 and the spatial desktop metaphor is neat. I went that route for a while. What this misses, however, is that the biggest problem with the desktop interface is that we've substantially increased application complexity and laptops (and even smaller devices) won. As a result, we're trying to answer the question "how we fit our skeuomorphic paradigm in a diminutive form factor". The inspiration involved much large…

For many people, the limiting factor of this is visual acuity though. I personally can't see it useful to have more than 2560x1440 equivalent pixels of space on a 27 inch monitor. For a larger monitor, you have to sit further back, so it is effectively the same. If you want to see more clearly, you'd need to get closer, but that causes issues since you are still limited by your available field of view.

It’s interesting you mention this. The way I use my desktop I always have my applications maximized and I just alt-tab to switch contexts. I also am in the terminal a lot and use Yaquake but not in maximized mode because I don’t want to focus in the bottom left corner of my screen. I also put the task bar left vertical because I don’t care about the horizontal space.

Doing all of this still felt cumbersome and then it dawned on me about a year ago, because I don’t game or watch full screen video, I think I’d much prefer the old 4x3 screens for my workflow.

Re: On Desktop GUI Minimalism

#29

Post by 40yearoldman »

Minimal desktops are productivity boosters. On top of that ones that can be controlled by keyboard input are super important.

99% of the time you just want information. Text. The chrome does not matter. Yet modern desktops and web pages make humans hunt and pick through poorly designed interfaces to get the info we need.

I use EXWM. It’s a time saver. I have no desktop because I am either using the full screen for a single application or flip flopping between a few apps that share the entire screen. This means every pixel of the screen is used and not wasted on useless images of empty fields.

In top of that I am able to designate windows and frames for specific jobs or functions, always able to recall the last terminal or most relevance.

We fucked up with movable windows. They are inefficient complicated and bring little value over a simple list of activities to switch between.

Re: On Desktop GUI Minimalism

#30

Post by GlenTheMachine »

I recently ran across helloSystem (https://hellosystem.github.io/docs/), which has as its hook the idea that we should base a unified desktop environment around the original Macintosh user interface guidelines. And while it's still pretty rough around the edges, it has FreeBSD underneath and I'm cautiously hopeful that it will turn into a useable desktop.
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