congrats to the deno team on launching this :)
Thanks <3
Deno KV Is in Open Beta
21–30 of 60 posts
Re: Deno KV Is in Open Beta
#22I don't know enough about this to make any real nuanced comments, but I hope they clean up this import cuz this is ugly: > import { Semaphore } from " https://deno.land/x/semaphore@v1.1.2/semaphore.ts "; Should just be~ > import { Semaphore } from "deno/utils"; Or something like that.
Deno has various mechanisms[0] for abbreviating your imports if/how you want to, but I like the fact that the canonical paths are plain, full URLs [0] https://deno.land/manual@v1.36.4/basics/import_maps
Yeah, it's actually a _feature_ if you've never been lost in the shit show that is node_modules before. I highly prefer Deno's style.
Re: Deno KV Is in Open Beta
#23Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is the enshittification of open source. It has been happening for a while with a bunch of startups like Supabase claiming to be "open source" and marketing themselves as such but making it really hard to self host for a long time. It wasn't just them either. I would see with disgust a bunch of startups use "open source" as their marketing tactic, no matter how hard it was to setup or run without their hosted ser…
> This is the enshittification of open source. You can simply not use it, no? I am not going to make any sweeping generalizations across all products. But at least in the case of Deno KV, there doesn't seem to be lock-in. So if you were running something self-hosted for KV persistence, it will continue to work unmodified. > I would see with disgust a bunch of startups use "open source" as their marketing tactic. Agai…
One does not have to use/not use something to have valid criticisms of it/opinions about it [1]
1 - https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/036/647/Scr...
Re: Deno KV Is in Open Beta
#24I poked around with this a few months ago to figure out how it works locally. The answer is SQLite: https://til.simonwillison.net/deno/deno-kv I'm finding the business model aspect of Deno KV absolutely fascinating. const kv = await Deno.openKv(); That's a Deno core API. It works fine in the open source version of Deno using a local SQLite database file. But as soon as you deploy your application to their proprietary…
I like this too... it's practical API but there's no way you can actually provide this production API for free. So instead of an open source project pulling back stuff you'd expect to be free (because it has zero marginal cost), they are adding stuff in that makes sense to be paid.
Re: Deno KV Is in Open Beta
#25I don't know enough about this to make any real nuanced comments, but I hope they clean up this import cuz this is ugly: > import { Semaphore } from " https://deno.land/x/semaphore@v1.1.2/semaphore.ts "; Should just be~ > import { Semaphore } from "deno/utils"; Or something like that.
What syntax would you suggest for importing a specific version of a library?
Re: Deno KV Is in Open Beta
#26I continue to watch Deno with excitement. I haven't had a good use case to play with it yet (all my free programming time has gone into my side business and I'm not ready to chance it on Deno yet) but I'll keep looking.
I find the way they handle secondary indexes very interesting. I mean under the hood I think DynamoDB does pretty much the same thing (stores the data multiple times) but instead of explicitly writing the data multiple times you define fields on the data that the secondary indexes use so the data is written there at the same time it's written to the primary (I could be a little mistaken, I'm working at a higher abstraction layer so I don't think about that). I can't decide which approach I like more. I will say that I don't think I'd need anything but my own abstraction layer to work with Deno KV vs DynamoDB. That said I still think DynamoDB is way more powerful overall.
As always I'm rooting for Deno to succeed.
Re: Deno KV Is in Open Beta
#27I poked around with this a few months ago to figure out how it works locally. The answer is SQLite: https://til.simonwillison.net/deno/deno-kv I'm finding the business model aspect of Deno KV absolutely fascinating. const kv = await Deno.openKv(); That's a Deno core API. It works fine in the open source version of Deno using a local SQLite database file. But as soon as you deploy your application to their proprietary…
> I'm having trouble thinking of a precedent for this - an open source project that has a core API which is effectively a lead generator for their proprietary cloud service. Is this not Vercel’s entire business model? I don’t think they invented it either.
I suppose it's a variation on the "freemium" model.
Re: Deno KV Is in Open Beta
#28Earlier quoted context omitted.
> This is the enshittification of open source. You can simply not use it, no? I am not going to make any sweeping generalizations across all products. But at least in the case of Deno KV, there doesn't seem to be lock-in. So if you were running something self-hosted for KV persistence, it will continue to work unmodified. > I would see with disgust a bunch of startups use "open source" as their marketing tactic. Agai…
One does not have to use/not use something to have valid criticisms of it/opinions about it [1] 1 - https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/036/647/Scr...
That meme doesn't further your point because the peasant is "using" society and understands the problems with it.
Re: Deno KV Is in Open Beta
#29Earlier quoted context omitted.
> This is the enshittification of open source. You can simply not use it, no? I am not going to make any sweeping generalizations across all products. But at least in the case of Deno KV, there doesn't seem to be lock-in. So if you were running something self-hosted for KV persistence, it will continue to work unmodified. > I would see with disgust a bunch of startups use "open source" as their marketing tactic. Agai…
One does not have to use/not use something to have valid criticisms of it/opinions about it [1] 1 - https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/036/647/Scr...
Isn't that the reverse? It's against the sentiment that being a part of system means that you implicitly agree with it, and any complaints you make about it are void.
Re: Deno KV Is in Open Beta
#30I poked around with this a few months ago to figure out how it works locally. The answer is SQLite: https://til.simonwillison.net/deno/deno-kv I'm finding the business model aspect of Deno KV absolutely fascinating. const kv = await Deno.openKv(); That's a Deno core API. It works fine in the open source version of Deno using a local SQLite database file. But as soon as you deploy your application to their proprietary…
Cloudflare KV is basically the exact same. Even the same name.
Cloudflare’s pricing seems more reasonable, though a 1:1 comparison is impossible. Cloudflare reads and writes in every region for the same price, Deno scales price with number of replica regions. Also CF is billed per read/write operation (and supports listing), this is billed per kB read/written.
That all said, if your values are bigger than ~2kB Cloudflare is almost certainly cheaper. And the list (with metadata) operation is quite powerful.
However, single-region means you don’t have to care about synchronization nearly as much, which can be quite annoying. The end user experience will suffer in areas far from your write zone though.
A better comparison might actually be Cloudflare D1, a hosted SQL with per-kB fees, but that’s still beta.