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The boiling frog of digital freedom

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Re: The boiling frog of digital freedom

#21

Post by max_ »

We need a new philosophical movement for computer technology.

The Stallman movement failed because it was not practical for business applications. At the end of the day, coders & hardware manufacturers need to eat just like accountants, plumbers and doctors. Technology can't rely 100% on altruism.

What we need is something close to the Ethical standards of the Stallman movement, but also compatable with business owners.

These philosophical ethical standards should also be ingrained into VC culture & corporate culture.

The reason why Apple can propose to have something like CSAM, or Google banning someone account forever (Gmail, YouTube et al) because they had images of their naked daughter suffering from a skin disease (to be sent to the doctor).

The reason is that there is no ethical-philosophical compass guiding computer technology.

Tech Corporate MBAs only care about "playing it safe". I find them disgustingly spinless.

Until we have this ethical-philosophy developed, I only expect technology to used as a tool for manipulation and control.

Re: The boiling frog of digital freedom

#23

Post by imiric »

tempodox wrote: post #18
sunbum wrote: post #5

> 2025: Google removes the ability to install Android apps from outside the Play store, citing security concerns. Yeah no, would be a direct violation of DMA at that point[1] [1] - https://digital-markets-act.ec.europa.eu/index_en

And yet you can only install through the AppStore on iOS.

Not in the EU soon, thankfully: https://www.techradar.com/news/ios-17-app-sideloading-might-...

Re: The boiling frog of digital freedom

#24

Post by dools »

max_ wrote: post #21

We need a new philosophical movement for computer technology. The Stallman movement failed because it was not practical for business applications. At the end of the day, coders & hardware manufacturers need to eat just like accountants, plumbers and doctors. Technology can't rely 100% on altruism. What we need is something close to the Ethical standards of the Stallman movement, but also compatable with business owne…

> The Stallman movement failed

Citation needed

Re: The boiling frog of digital freedom

#25

Post by thriftwy »

attah_ wrote: post #19

There is one interesting force acting against that though (or it would probably already have happened). It is the simple fact that most people that are competent enough to actually implement these things also understand the problems with doing so. For the most part anyway. If we could just agree to not do that... well, what are "they" going to do? And of course: we owe it to the web to use Firefox. The Chrome clones…

This never stopped Facebook from being Facebook.

Re: The boiling frog of digital freedom

#26

Post by dools »

lifeisstillgood wrote: post #3

This rather heavily begs the question what do we mean by "freedom"? We don't mean anonymity. Acting in secret is not freedom - acting openly and not being persecuted or prosecuted is freedom. The solution is what it is in real offline life. A regulated legal framework that allows most and limits little, a open dynamic culture that accepts diversity and constant change. If we are worried that digital freedom will be t…

> This rather heavily begs the question what do we mean by "freedom"?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question

Re: The boiling frog of digital freedom

#27

Post by attah_ »

lifeisstillgood wrote: post #3

This rather heavily begs the question what do we mean by "freedom"? We don't mean anonymity. Acting in secret is not freedom - acting openly and not being persecuted or prosecuted is freedom. The solution is what it is in real offline life. A regulated legal framework that allows most and limits little, a open dynamic culture that accepts diversity and constant change. If we are worried that digital freedom will be t…

To expand on your idea to compare with the "real offline life"... While anonymity should not need to be a top-priority goal in and of itself, you also don't see people running around with their id-cards taped to their foreheads for easy access.

Re: The boiling frog of digital freedom

#29

Post by max_ »

dools wrote: post #24
max_ wrote: post #21

We need a new philosophical movement for computer technology. The Stallman movement failed because it was not practical for business applications. At the end of the day, coders & hardware manufacturers need to eat just like accountants, plumbers and doctors. Technology can't rely 100% on altruism. What we need is something close to the Ethical standards of the Stallman movement, but also compatable with business owne…

> The Stallman movement failed Citation needed

How many applications, phones, computers do people use that are Stallman compliant?

Re: The boiling frog of digital freedom

#30

Post by ajsnigrutin »

attah_ wrote: post #19

There is one interesting force acting against that though (or it would probably already have happened). It is the simple fact that most people that are competent enough to actually implement these things also understand the problems with doing so. For the most part anyway. If we could just agree to not do that... well, what are "they" going to do? And of course: we owe it to the web to use Firefox. The Chrome clones…

Yeah, chrome and google in general are the first in line to cause problems.

There are many browsers, many apps, many everything... you can switch whenever... but the DRM and attestation pushes with browsers (and mobile devices) means, that sure, you can use a different browser, but your bank, your streaming service, your newssite might not work unless you're using chrome with drm and hardware attestation. This is already true with many banking apps, where you cannot even start the app on a rooted phone, a phone with an unlocked bootloader or even just a phone that's "not on the list".

So yeah... google is the silent killer of the "free interet" and te world happily follows... sadly.

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