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A complete guide to building a hand-wired keyboard (2020)

crackedthecode.co

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Re: A complete guide to building a hand-wired keyboard (2020)

#21

Post by baz00 »

onetimeuse92304 wrote: post #9

As an amateur EE, here my thoughts. If you can do CAD you can probably also design a PCB with a socket for some kind of general purpose MCU or even one of ready-made keyboard controllers. Through-hole soldering is IMO actually simpler than making these "spiders" (that's how in my country we call circuits with self-supported wire to wire joints, usually with at least some components hanging in air by their leads). "Sp…

Yeah this on all counts.

Ultimately it's probably better to have a triple-layer for the keyboard from what I can see. The faceplate that the switches are mounted on, the PCB and then the back plate. Could probably sandwich it all together easily.

There's nothing wrong with dead bug though but on this scale and reliability requirements and mechanical stress, it's the wrong solution for the problem.

Re: A complete guide to building a hand-wired keyboard (2020)

#22

Post by baz00 »

spinningarrow wrote: post #17
onetimeuse92304 wrote: post #9

As an amateur EE, here my thoughts. If you can do CAD you can probably also design a PCB with a socket for some kind of general purpose MCU or even one of ready-made keyboard controllers. Through-hole soldering is IMO actually simpler than making these "spiders" (that's how in my country we call circuits with self-supported wire to wire joints, usually with at least some components hanging in air by their leads). "Sp…

I think the biggest advantage of point to point wiring for a lot of people is that you can simply go ahead and do it at home. For PCBs, you need to know how to use one of the design tools but more importantly you need to find a place to print them.

It's really easy to do. Particularly the getting them made bit. I just did a quote for a 2 layer board that's TKL keyboard sized and to get 5 made it's about £20 delivered to my door from JLCPCB.

Re: A complete guide to building a hand-wired keyboard (2020)

#23

Post by beeforpork »

Soldering 1N4148 so close to the glass body, plus using a thick drop of solder, makes it really easy to overheat the diode. They are everywhere because they are cheap, not because they are robust... The diodes may become unconditionally conductive, so it may not be an obvious bug.

I fried many of them, because my soldering skills were not that good, I did not read the data sheet and so my iron was too hot and I soldered them for too long. Plus by using short wires, all the heat transferred into that fragile glass body.

Re: A complete guide to building a hand-wired keyboard (2020)

#24

Post by onetimeuse92304 »

fellerts wrote: post #12
onetimeuse92304 wrote: post #9

As an amateur EE, here my thoughts. If you can do CAD you can probably also design a PCB with a socket for some kind of general purpose MCU or even one of ready-made keyboard controllers. Through-hole soldering is IMO actually simpler than making these "spiders" (that's how in my country we call circuits with self-supported wire to wire joints, usually with at least some components hanging in air by their leads). "Sp…

This method is usually referred to as "Dead Bug" style wiring in English, because the end result usually resembles a dead bug with its legs curled inwards.

No, it is not. Although I can't fault you for thinking this as there are so many people using this term incorrectly.

"Dead bug" is referring to mounting chips on their back with wires connected to leads going in all directions. Hence "dead" -- live bugs don't usually spend time laying on their backs. When you see it you immediately know why it is called "dead bug"...

Here, this is how it looks like: http://dangerousprototypes.com/blog/2012/11/15/fine-pitch-bg...

This technique is usually used to connect to leads of packages that usually have their leads hidden on the bottom of the package (for example BGA). These packages usually require a PCB made for them or some kind of adapter. They also require a bit more complex soldering process that might be just out of reach of an enthusiast (like good hot air station or reflow oven, etc.) If you find yourself with a component you want to quickly test and don't have an adapter... you improvise and this may result in a dead bug. I did it a lot of times myself.

This technique is also sometimes used in production where they have an existing through hole board (or other board that is incompatible with the process required to mount the component). Sometimes it is easier to just "dead bug" the component than redesign entire board for the new process.

Re: A complete guide to building a hand-wired keyboard (2020)

#25

Post by rgoulter »

hnlmorg wrote: post #7
wakeupcall wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My impression for the popularity of the 75% form factor is due to laptops and people being accustomed to never have used the "missing" keys in the first place. A tell-tale is that default layout even for thinkpads is to set the Fn row to media keys by default... An increasingly smaller number of people use them, despite being a row of freely remappable keys right _there_. What I've seen happen though is that especial…

I completely agree. I never understood this craze of removing keys. The number pad is another example of this. Typing numbers is massively more comfortable (and quicker too) on the number pad than it is with the row of numbers just below the F-keys. The amount of desk space people save is so negligible, particularly when people who buy these keyboards typically work in “paperless” offices, that I never understood the…

> I never understood this craze of removing keys.

There are (roughly) two families of "smaller keyboards".

Those with a big spacebar, and those with multiple thumbkeys.

Big-spacebar-small-keyboards are like laptop keyboards.

Whereas, for other kinds of small keyboards (such as the moonlander or planck) which provide thumbkeys, I'd say the emphasis is more about "bringing the full functionality of the keyboard to within easy reach of the hands" rather than "remove keys for whatever reason".

On traditional keyboards, the thumbs only get to use 1 key. A big spacebar is such an odd and inefficient use of keyboard real estate.

Whereas, with 2-3 keys each, the thumbs can be put to good use. e.g. It's much more comfortable to press backspace with the thumb, than to move your hand (or reach with the pinky finger).

Re: A complete guide to building a hand-wired keyboard (2020)

#26

Post by qwerty456127 »

hnlmorg wrote: post #7
wakeupcall wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My impression for the popularity of the 75% form factor is due to laptops and people being accustomed to never have used the "missing" keys in the first place. A tell-tale is that default layout even for thinkpads is to set the Fn row to media keys by default... An increasingly smaller number of people use them, despite being a row of freely remappable keys right _there_. What I've seen happen though is that especial…

I completely agree. I never understood this craze of removing keys. The number pad is another example of this. Typing numbers is massively more comfortable (and quicker too) on the number pad than it is with the row of numbers just below the F-keys. The amount of desk space people save is so negligible, particularly when people who buy these keyboards typically work in “paperless” offices, that I never understood the…

> Typing numbers is massively more comfortable (and quicker too) on the number pad than it is with the row of numbers

Let alone than with the row of numbers holding a Shift pressed (some languages require this because they remap the row for extra letters).

Re: A complete guide to building a hand-wired keyboard (2020)

#27

Post by rmaus »

onetimeuse92304 wrote: post #9

As an amateur EE, here my thoughts. If you can do CAD you can probably also design a PCB with a socket for some kind of general purpose MCU or even one of ready-made keyboard controllers. Through-hole soldering is IMO actually simpler than making these "spiders" (that's how in my country we call circuits with self-supported wire to wire joints, usually with at least some components hanging in air by their leads). "Sp…

There are certain kinds of fully custom keyboards, such as the one I use (Dactyl Manuform) where the keys do not sit on a single flat plane. Such a build would require a flexible PCB. This is doable for the advanced-amateur EE but the geometry is fiddly, at best, and doesn't allow for easy experimentation on key placement (spacing, offset, radius, etc, the bigger problem for me).

I've found the happy medium with single-switch PCBs ("Amoeba" is a popular one), which are fast and easy to wire up. Most notably you don't have to do the painstaking row wire stripping -- just use a plain wire from one PCB to the next in the key matrix (or an insulated wire if you have to traverse other components, which still only requires two stripped ends).

I have a few pictures floating around from my build(s) if that interests anyone.

Re: A complete guide to building a hand-wired keyboard (2020)

#28

Post by qwerty456127 »

eviks wrote: post #15
hnlmorg wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I completely agree. I never understood this craze of removing keys. The number pad is another example of this. Typing numbers is massively more comfortable (and quicker too) on the number pad than it is with the row of numbers just below the F-keys. The amount of desk space people save is so negligible, particularly when people who buy these keyboards typically work in “paperless” offices, that I never understood the…

Why would you move your hand to the numpad if you can use your orthostaggered "numpad" with a layer right where your hand already is on the alpha keys?

As I already mentioned 4-5 times, one of the languages I use regularly reuses the number row for extra letters (and it isn't even enough for all of them). I have to hold Shift pressed to enter a number this way (using a keypad feels much better) or use CapsLock to enter a capital of such a letter.

Re: A complete guide to building a hand-wired keyboard (2020)

#29

Post by qwerty456127 »

unnouinceput wrote: post #8
qwerty456127 wrote: post #2

Sounds very interesting. I have looked through premium and "custom" keyboards market recently and found out their customness mostly is about look&feel, key placement and omitting "unnecessary" keys while I want a positively custom set of keys: as many keys as possible - full keypad, multimedia keys separate from f1-12 keys, Windows context menu key, also programmable macro keys if possible, no spatial "optimizations"…

Same here. All these modern keyboards are missing a lot of what old one had. The most I miss most is the Alt GR one, the bigger ENTER key and I want a lot of space. Call me fat fingers if you want. So I started to actually create my own. And I want it to be programmable. And movable, as in you can move the key around, enlarge or shrink them. And when I say I want them programmable I meant to pull a little gizmo out o…

I agree but I don't need the keys look anything. The best thing happened to my keyboard life so far was having to use a keyboard without the letters of a language I used daily drawn on it. I would rather buy "das keyboard" with purely black keys but it doesn't have enough keys for me to invest in.

However, I would love to have your software-defined visually configurable keyboard as a second one on my table and every app using it as a sorg of a "toolbar" / command palette. This was what Apple tried sort of (it would have been nice idea if they didn't sacrifice a real keys row for it). To me it sounds like an additional display with touch support can do the job.

Re: A complete guide to building a hand-wired keyboard (2020)

#30

Post by joncrocks »

hnlmorg wrote: post #7
wakeupcall wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My impression for the popularity of the 75% form factor is due to laptops and people being accustomed to never have used the "missing" keys in the first place. A tell-tale is that default layout even for thinkpads is to set the Fn row to media keys by default... An increasingly smaller number of people use them, despite being a row of freely remappable keys right _there_. What I've seen happen though is that especial…

I completely agree. I never understood this craze of removing keys. The number pad is another example of this. Typing numbers is massively more comfortable (and quicker too) on the number pad than it is with the row of numbers just below the F-keys. The amount of desk space people save is so negligible, particularly when people who buy these keyboards typically work in “paperless” offices, that I never understood the…

I think it's a concession that use of particular parts of the keyboard is person and context specific.

e.g. At home, I only very occasionally enter numbers. I very frequently use my mouse, and have large monitors. So I sacrifice slightly less convenient number entry for slightly more room for my mouse(pad) all the time.

At work, I have a full-size keyboard and I spend a higher proportion of my time typing and entering numbers.

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