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At this company, we are family

pboyd.io

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Re: At this company, we are family

#21

Post by FredPret »

jylam wrote: post #16

I especially like the very American "I ask that you refrain from discussing your termination with any social contacts made through your membership in the family [...] Failure to comply may result in your severance being terminated early or withheld entirely." In (most of ?) Europe, this severance is law and not debatable (as discovered by Musk recently), so this sentence would be outright illegal. You can talk about…

As you so sarcastically point out, Americans give up many employment rights such as these.

But it's not a one-way street. Being easier to fire makes American employees easier to hire, which is at least in part responsible for much higher pay in the USA compared to employee havens such as Europe.

Furthermore, Americans tend to pay less tax. This isn't usually thought of as an employee rights issue, but in my mind, keeping more of your money = stronger property rights

Re: At this company, we are family

#22

Post by jylam »

foobarian wrote: post #19
jylam wrote: post #16

I especially like the very American "I ask that you refrain from discussing your termination with any social contacts made through your membership in the family [...] Failure to comply may result in your severance being terminated early or withheld entirely." In (most of ?) Europe, this severance is law and not debatable (as discovered by Musk recently), so this sentence would be outright illegal. You can talk about…

Would that sentence in itself be illegal? Or just if the promised action is performed?

For a company to threaten to do this.

Re: At this company, we are family

#23

Post by gonehome »

jylam wrote: post #16

I especially like the very American "I ask that you refrain from discussing your termination with any social contacts made through your membership in the family [...] Failure to comply may result in your severance being terminated early or withheld entirely." In (most of ?) Europe, this severance is law and not debatable (as discovered by Musk recently), so this sentence would be outright illegal. You can talk about…

Independent of the tongue-in-cheek joke of this post, software salaries in the US are triple (or more) than those in Europe, I'd rather keep the tradeoffs we have even if that means there are downsides - the upsides are worth it.

I suspect the labor protections in Europe are part of the reason there aren't many billion dollar software companies there and the salaries are low, hiring is risky when firing is hard.

Re: At this company, we are family

#25

Post by sashank_1509 »

The problem with this and many companies trying to be family etc, is that they completely misunderstand what a family is.

Most think a family is a group where people love each other and care for each other. This is wrong, love and affections are symptoms of a healthy family, you can love and care for your friends, you don’t have a family with them. You can actually not really like spending time with many people in your family, but you are still a part of a functioning family (many such cases). In extreme dysfunction, individuals in a family face abuse but for all our intuition they still are a part of a family until the state intervenes.

To this one might say a family is then bonds that occur due to blood relations between its members. This again is a symptom, children in an adoptive family still constitute a family.

So what exactly is a family? A family is a binding contract where individuals agree to stay together regardless of the circumstances. In the past this contract was enforced to death out of necessity, now this contract is enforced out of necessity till the child becomes 18 generally. There may be hatred, sickness, or a litany of other disturbances but the individuals still stick by each other. This by definition is something a company cannot recreate (without coming awfully close to slavery), and thus it is hopeless for a company to try to aim to be your family. You can leave when you want and they can let you go when they want. That simply is not the same bond as a family.

Re: At this company, we are family

#26

Post by somenits »

jylam wrote: post #16

I especially like the very American "I ask that you refrain from discussing your termination with any social contacts made through your membership in the family [...] Failure to comply may result in your severance being terminated early or withheld entirely." In (most of ?) Europe, this severance is law and not debatable (as discovered by Musk recently), so this sentence would be outright illegal. You can talk about…

I could respond with something equally condescending and sarcastic like “You Europeans should try not legislating yourselves into laughably low salaries,” but that would be rude and counterproductive.

Re: At this company, we are family

#27

Post by systemvoltage »

jylam wrote: post #16

I especially like the very American "I ask that you refrain from discussing your termination with any social contacts made through your membership in the family [...] Failure to comply may result in your severance being terminated early or withheld entirely." In (most of ?) Europe, this severance is law and not debatable (as discovered by Musk recently), so this sentence would be outright illegal. You can talk about…

Tbh, I prefer the American style (both as someone who has worked as a employee and someone who has employed).

I also think this type of European mentality is the reason for its stagnation. Constant regulation that saps the energy out of amazing talent in Europe.

Re: At this company, we are family

#28

Post by aroundtown »

jylam wrote: post #16

I especially like the very American "I ask that you refrain from discussing your termination with any social contacts made through your membership in the family [...] Failure to comply may result in your severance being terminated early or withheld entirely." In (most of ?) Europe, this severance is law and not debatable (as discovered by Musk recently), so this sentence would be outright illegal. You can talk about…

> You should fight for some more rights, sometime I wish we could fight for more rights. We are too spread out for protests to work. The politicians do everything they can to separate themselves from their electorate. And the average person doesn't have enough money to weather a week of no paychecks. Meanwhile half the populace gets angry at the thought of helping out anyone beneath them as they don't want them to get ahead.

The worst is that you have a very vocal minority trying to constantly burn down the house so that they can be king of the burn pit.

Re: At this company, we are family

#29

Post by Brusco_RF »

intothemild wrote: post #18
me_jumper wrote: post #8

Gosh, I hate “we are a family” companies so much.

As someone who's autistic, these kinds of companies are very difficult for me. Usually the "we're family" companies are also the "let's have a social event constantly", or return to the office days are also just filled with socializing. I get it.. some people really enjoy that, but that's not everyone. It feels like it's by design to exclude other kinds of people who don't enjoy a hyper social environment.

I don't think company-sponsored social events are designed to exclude non-social types, they're just for the benefit of social employees.

Of course, this is coming from someone who really enjoys drinking on the company dime

Re: At this company, we are family

#30

Post by quux »

jylam wrote: post #16

I especially like the very American "I ask that you refrain from discussing your termination with any social contacts made through your membership in the family [...] Failure to comply may result in your severance being terminated early or withheld entirely." In (most of ?) Europe, this severance is law and not debatable (as discovered by Musk recently), so this sentence would be outright illegal. You can talk about…

Is that kind of language legal in states like CA and NY with WARN laws?
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