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Company builds 500cc ‘one-stroke’ engine

thedrive.com

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Re: Company builds 500cc ‘one-stroke’ engine

#21

Post by timlarshanson »

merth wrote: post #19
rolph wrote: post #3

actually a two stroke, 2 opposing pistons in a common cylinder cycling through compression stroke-combustion-power stroke. no connecting rod to bend or break, and large cams replacing the crankshaft https://www.thedrive.com/uploads/2023/07/14/innengine-1.gif?... [Now, here's the thing: this motor isn't a one-stroke engine. It has a compression stroke and exhaust stroke, making it a two-stroke cycle. INNengine acknowl…

why I feel like this would put pressure on one side of cylinder block due to non-linear force against bottom wave-plate and cause wear and tear?

Agreed.

Also, how does it get started? Seems like the only force pushing the piston against the axial cam is the fuel explosion. (Perhaps extra springs to retract the piston for intake?)

Re: Company builds 500cc ‘one-stroke’ engine

#22

Post by fuzzy2 »

jauntywundrkind wrote: post #12

120 HP is 88kW. You could shrink this considerably & still have a very nice range extender. (Edited: proper conversion)

That conversion is the wrong way around. 120 HP is roughly 88 kW. The point still stands, of course. If it indeed can be shrunk further while remaining efficient.

Re: Company builds 500cc ‘one-stroke’ engine

#24

Post by windexh8er »

rolph wrote: post #3

actually a two stroke, 2 opposing pistons in a common cylinder cycling through compression stroke-combustion-power stroke. no connecting rod to bend or break, and large cams replacing the crankshaft https://www.thedrive.com/uploads/2023/07/14/innengine-1.gif?... [Now, here's the thing: this motor isn't a one-stroke engine. It has a compression stroke and exhaust stroke, making it a two-stroke cycle. INNengine acknowl…

> this is 120HP in 500cc displacement, which is superbike engine stuff

HP-wise, maybe. But the reality is this is not a performant engine you'll see replacing high performance 2 or 4 stroke motors anytime soon.

First is that the company has lied a lot in their marketing. They imply that the motor is naturally aspirated and then show a car, with said plant running a very obvious supercharger. They also lie about the motor type - there is no viable 1-stroke motor and there likely never will be based on the laws that govern our planet. They even admit to their own lie in the name of marketing (a non-oil burning 2-stroke is not a 1-stroke by default).

The real reason this motor will not touch a comparable superbike cc-to-cc is that this motor has no claimed torque specs. It really doesn't matter at all if they're able to put out 120HP in 500cc if it has low torque. And we know it has low torque based on the fact that this motor has no crankshaft, and therefore the mechanical advantage that adds.

I currently have 650, 800 and 850cc 2-stroke motors today that have similar HP-to-cc today compared to the 120HP they've claimed from 500cc. The difference is that all these motors have the torque required for driving performance.

While I would love to see something bridge the gap of small heavy 4-stroke vs light oil burning 2-stroke this is, unfortunately, not it.

Re: Company builds 500cc ‘one-stroke’ engine

#25

Post by windexh8er »

jacquesm wrote: post #15
ksaj wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed. My old bike had 1400cc and was rated at only 94 hp.

'old' may have something to do with it here, engine tech has seen all kinds of improvements over the last two decades resulting in tiny engines with ridiculous levels of output while still having reasonable life span. A pretty common small car engine that has .9 L displacement and a turbo yields 105 HP, that's 120 HP/L, vs 67 HP/L for your bike. A few years ago I had a 660 CC 4 cylinder engine in a car that did 67 HP…

We should probably call a spade a spade here. This is a 2-stroke motor. In today's powersports world it's normal for a factory 650cc motor to be putting out over 135HP. It's not impressive in terms of the performance to engine size and, as I mentioned in another comment, this engine will be extremely weak on the torque side of the equation which will make those ponies virtually useless.

Re: Company builds 500cc ‘one-stroke’ engine

#26

Post by watson »

ksaj wrote: post #9

Something to notice in the line drawing: The rear is powered by an electric motor. I assume that's to get it moving in the first place before there's enough momentum for this engine to keep it going.

I would assume so, yes. This is exactly how regular motors get started, unless you have one of those old-timy cranks you had to manually turn to get the motor running

Re: Company builds 500cc ‘one-stroke’ engine

#27

Post by pengaru »

timlarshanson wrote: post #21
merth wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why I feel like this would put pressure on one side of cylinder block due to non-linear force against bottom wave-plate and cause wear and tear?

Agreed. Also, how does it get started? Seems like the only force pushing the piston against the axial cam is the fuel explosion. (Perhaps extra springs to retract the piston for intake?)

> Also, how does it get started? Seems like the only force pushing the piston against the axial cam is the fuel explosion. (Perhaps extra springs to retract the piston for intake?)

In lieu of combustion you still have the air spring rebound from the compression... (at least until the exhaust opens)

Re: Company builds 500cc ‘one-stroke’ engine

#28

Post by Justsignedup »

Animats wrote: post #18

That's neat. This is a type of axial engine, a cam engine.[1] People have been trying designs along this line since at least 1926. A recent version was from Axial Vector Engine, which was pushing their stock around 2006 and is now gone.[2] The problem with this class of designs is that they apply large forces to small parts. The most likely source of trouble is the bearings of those little wheels at the base of each…

also noted, that they don't have that lever like standard pistons do, so torque is an issue.

Re: Company builds 500cc ‘one-stroke’ engine

#29

Post by Enginerrrd »

LispSporks22 wrote: post #20

Would this be good in a bike? Would it likely be more power than say my R1?

I don't think it'd be very good.

It has no torque on the low end so you'd have to set idle really high to get useful low range performance.

This type of engine is great for its intended application though: A steady-state range extender/generator.

Now, at higher revs, it might be pretty sweet.

Re: Company builds 500cc ‘one-stroke’ engine

#30

Post by Ancapistani »

Justsignedup wrote: post #28
Animats wrote: post #18

That's neat. This is a type of axial engine, a cam engine.[1] People have been trying designs along this line since at least 1926. A recent version was from Axial Vector Engine, which was pushing their stock around 2006 and is now gone.[2] The problem with this class of designs is that they apply large forces to small parts. The most likely source of trouble is the bearings of those little wheels at the base of each…

also noted, that they don't have that lever like standard pistons do, so torque is an issue.

Torque isn’t an issue if it isn’t pushing a drivetrain, but an inverter generator to charge the electric drivetrain.

That would also lower the forces applied to the piston roller bearings, which should greatly improve reliability.

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