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Escaping High School

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Re: Escaping High School

#21

Post by jimcsharp »

FoomFries wrote: post #8
bell-cot wrote: post #2

Decades ago, an old friend of mine had a go-getter son, who started a lawn care business when he was ~15. Son was talented, and his business grew very fast. (This was in a well-to-do suburb, before there were so many lawn care businesses. Plenty of good HS students available to hire, and the trucks were leased.) For getting into top-ranked colleges, "the summer business I started in HS is already paying me more than…

I disagree. I think that what college offers is more than an increase in salary. For hyperbole’s sake, you could use the argument of ‘my trust fund is already paying me more than your median graduate’s full-time job’ and most would roll their eyes at such a statement.

Getting money that way isn't impressive, though. But surely there's some value to someone who's, presumably, intrinsically motivated to attend for some reason. That thing everyone born on the treadmill fakes being.

Re: Escaping High School

#22

Post by ameister14 »

hardware2win wrote: post #5

Pretty decent collection of reasonable advices Especially this: Make sure you aren’t just doing a glorified version of trying to earn good grades. So many people failed on this, mostly because of parents. Dont put effort just for the sake of grades, they are worthless. Just small nitpick to #1 Learning just in time =/= learning via practice Learning just in case, the opposite of JIT makes sense too, but is "unpredict…

>Dont put effort just for the sake of grades, they are worthless.

They aren't worthless.

Grades make it easier and cheaper for you to go to college. Good grades in college make it far, far easier to get jobs and can get you in the door to significantly better and higher paying jobs or grad school.

So not worthless, just not the be all and end all.

Re: Escaping High School

#23

Post by Eumenes »

FoomFries wrote: post #8
bell-cot wrote: post #2

Decades ago, an old friend of mine had a go-getter son, who started a lawn care business when he was ~15. Son was talented, and his business grew very fast. (This was in a well-to-do suburb, before there were so many lawn care businesses. Plenty of good HS students available to hire, and the trucks were leased.) For getting into top-ranked colleges, "the summer business I started in HS is already paying me more than…

I disagree. I think that what college offers is more than an increase in salary. For hyperbole’s sake, you could use the argument of ‘my trust fund is already paying me more than your median graduate’s full-time job’ and most would roll their eyes at such a statement.

> ‘my trust fund is already paying me more than your median graduate’s full-time job’

that'd be a good argument too. why go to college if you have income security? go do something infinitely more interesting and fulfilling

Re: Escaping High School

#24

Post by light_hue_1 »

bell-cot wrote: post #2

Decades ago, an old friend of mine had a go-getter son, who started a lawn care business when he was ~15. Son was talented, and his business grew very fast. (This was in a well-to-do suburb, before there were so many lawn care businesses. Plenty of good HS students available to hire, and the trucks were leased.) For getting into top-ranked colleges, "the summer business I started in HS is already paying me more than…

> For getting into top-ranked colleges, "the summer business I started in HS is already paying me more than your median graduate's full-time job" is a slam-dunk argument.

No. It's really not. As someone who has been involved in the system that admits you to top ranked universities and whose summer hustle also paid well in highschool. This is not a slam dunk. It's one small piece. And it could easily backfire and be a negative depending on how you write it. For example by writing it as if it's a slam dunk.

These sort of overt economic arguments tend to go over very poorly.

Re: Escaping High School

#25

Post by dfxm12 »

bell-cot wrote: post #16
FoomFries wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. I think that what college offers is more than an increase in salary. For hyperbole’s sake, you could use the argument of ‘my trust fund is already paying me more than your median graduate’s full-time job’ and most would roll their eyes at such a statement.

Try talking to someone who's worked a few decades as a Development Officer at a major university. Would they want their institution to be associated with Mr. "I will never need to actually work" Trust Fundee? Or with a real-world proven entrepreneur & business management prodigy?

FWIW, with a 42% admission rate, donor-related applicants are 7 times more likely to be admitted to Harvard than other applicants. Based on this, I would say they tend to want to be associated with people who already have money, regardless of what they may say.

Re: Escaping High School

#26

Post by hardware2win »

ameister14 wrote: post #22
hardware2win wrote: post #5

Pretty decent collection of reasonable advices Especially this: Make sure you aren’t just doing a glorified version of trying to earn good grades. So many people failed on this, mostly because of parents. Dont put effort just for the sake of grades, they are worthless. Just small nitpick to #1 Learning just in time =/= learning via practice Learning just in case, the opposite of JIT makes sense too, but is "unpredict…

>Dont put effort just for the sake of grades, they are worthless. They aren't worthless. Grades make it easier and cheaper for you to go to college. Good grades in college make it far, far easier to get jobs and can get you in the door to significantly better and higher paying jobs or grad school. So not worthless, just not the be all and end all.

In my country higher edu institutions look at final exam scores, not grades.

Grades are terrible due to bias, difficulty when it comes to comparing them and lack of transparency.

At best they show effort (or "caring" parents)

>Good grades in college make it far, far easier to get jobs and can get you in the door to significantly better and higher

Thats why there should be fair and transparent exam after college :)

This way everything is up to your score, not school name or cool prof who inflates grades

Re: Escaping High School

#27

Post by ModernMech »

jimcsharp wrote: post #21
FoomFries wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. I think that what college offers is more than an increase in salary. For hyperbole’s sake, you could use the argument of ‘my trust fund is already paying me more than your median graduate’s full-time job’ and most would roll their eyes at such a statement.

Getting money that way isn't impressive, though. But surely there's some value to someone who's, presumably, intrinsically motivated to attend for some reason. That thing everyone born on the treadmill fakes being.

> Getting money that way isn't impressive, though.

Depending on how big the trust fund is, I think you'll find it will open more doors than a summer lawncare initiative.

Re: Escaping High School

#28

Post by light_hue_1 »

bell-cot wrote: post #16
FoomFries wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. I think that what college offers is more than an increase in salary. For hyperbole’s sake, you could use the argument of ‘my trust fund is already paying me more than your median graduate’s full-time job’ and most would roll their eyes at such a statement.

Try talking to someone who's worked a few decades as a Development Officer at a major university. Would they want their institution to be associated with Mr. "I will never need to actually work" Trust Fundee? Or with a real-world proven entrepreneur & business management prodigy?

You've either never spoken to people in development or didn't understand what they do.

For one, they aren't involved in admissions at all.

Their goal is to make long term relationships so that both sides, the donors and the university get something out of it. Not to judge people based on where their money or connections come from.

Re: Escaping High School

#29

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

ameister14 wrote: post #22
hardware2win wrote: post #5

Pretty decent collection of reasonable advices Especially this: Make sure you aren’t just doing a glorified version of trying to earn good grades. So many people failed on this, mostly because of parents. Dont put effort just for the sake of grades, they are worthless. Just small nitpick to #1 Learning just in time =/= learning via practice Learning just in case, the opposite of JIT makes sense too, but is "unpredict…

>Dont put effort just for the sake of grades, they are worthless. They aren't worthless. Grades make it easier and cheaper for you to go to college. Good grades in college make it far, far easier to get jobs and can get you in the door to significantly better and higher paying jobs or grad school. So not worthless, just not the be all and end all.

It is almost certainly not worth your time to try to be in the top 10 in your class.

Nearly everyone is much better off doing other things with their time than studying to try to get an elite college for a good deal.

There's little evidence that where you go to school matters.

If you take Albert Einstein and you put him in a community college, he's still going to be Albert Einstein, and you're still going to just be you at Harvard.

Re: Escaping High School

#30

Post by bell-cot »

dfxm12 wrote: post #25
bell-cot wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try talking to someone who's worked a few decades as a Development Officer at a major university. Would they want their institution to be associated with Mr. "I will never need to actually work" Trust Fundee? Or with a real-world proven entrepreneur & business management prodigy?

FWIW, with a 42% admission rate, donor-related applicants are 7 times more likely to be admitted to Harvard than other applicants. Based on this, I would say they tend to want to be associated with people who already have money, regardless of what they may say.

Yes-ish.

If the wealth "in play" is merely a trust fund large enough so that the applicant can live modestly without ever working, they won't care. (And any "I don't need to work" argument would be a huge red flag.) Similarly - I cannot give my grand-niece a 7X boost on getting into Harvard by donating $1,000 to Harvard.

Vs...if I was a billionaire, and ask a Harvard Development Officer about my grand-niece getting admitted to Harvard, then I could get her far more than a 7X boost.

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