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Why is desalination so difficult?

practical.engineering

21–30 of 644 posts

Re: Why is desalination so difficult?

#21
post #13
post #11

several better ways, multi stage stills and reverse osmosis are leaders of the pack, https://www.veoliawatertechnologies.com/en/technologies/mult... . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_osmosis

The author specifically mentions reverse osmosis.

Yes, RO is energetically the best, but places with geothermal excess, like iceland might choose the heat based method as they have free heat = the still warm water discharged after power still is warm enough for distillation.

Re: Why is desalination so difficult?

#22
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Separating two things isn't necessarily expensive. Think of coin sorters that just use gravity and different sized holes.

You need to bring the coins uphill in the first place.

Right, but that’s easy. If desalination only required lifting each unit of water a few inches we probably wouldn’t say it’s particularly difficult.

Re: Why is desalination so difficult?

#23
Slightly off topic, however, the post references the Carlsbad desalination facility. If you find yourself in San Diego and like oysters, I would highly recommend you checkout the Carlsbad Aquafarm. Take the tour and pick up some oysters.

What's really interesting and relevant to the topic is that the oyster farm serves as a pre-filter to the desalination plant and there's an symbiotic relationship between the plant and the oyster farm.

Re: Why is desalination so difficult?

#24
post #9

Probably very dumb idea, but would it be feasible to just pump and sprinkle sea-water on hot, dry desert and let it naturally evaporate, and then collect it as fresh rainwater back? i.e. how much water would you need to evaporate to have a noticeable increase in rainfall?

There is talk about pumping sea water into the Saharan desert in certain parts, which gets at that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2b7ztWvFOg

Re: Why is desalination so difficult?

#25
post #6

I remember reading that it causes some problems related to fishing because the fish all migrate further out.

The worry is a local increase of salinity levels, due to putting the brine back in the ocean. I think that is a solvable issue though. We can harvest some of the salt and then mix the resulting brine with reclaimed water. Then spread that out instead of dumping it in one area. We could also create inland salt deposits.

The biggest issue is cost for these plants and it isn't worth spending the political capital to build them yet.

Re: Why is desalination so difficult?

#26
post #9

Probably very dumb idea, but would it be feasible to just pump and sprinkle sea-water on hot, dry desert and let it naturally evaporate, and then collect it as fresh rainwater back? i.e. how much water would you need to evaporate to have a noticeable increase in rainfall?

A desert is a living ecosystem. Evaporating salt water would leave behind substantial salt solids. Think Great Salt Lake.

Re: Why is desalination so difficult?

#27
post #9

Probably very dumb idea, but would it be feasible to just pump and sprinkle sea-water on hot, dry desert and let it naturally evaporate, and then collect it as fresh rainwater back? i.e. how much water would you need to evaporate to have a noticeable increase in rainfall?

Israel does this for a different reason: To collect minerals from the dead sea.

It doesn't increase rainfall.

Israel is actually desalinating water and rejuvenating a river, which eventually will reach the dead sea (although that's not why they are doing it, but it makes the point that evaporating water isn't doing much).

Maybe you mean on a far larger scale?

Well - the ocean itself is much larger, and water evaporates from its surface all the time. Humans aren't going to make an evaporation zone larger than the ocean.

Also: Water does not (mainly) evaporate because of heat, but rather because of wind. There's lots of heat in the desert, but not much wind. The ocean has a ton of wind.

Re: Why is desalination so difficult?

#28
post #3

It's not difficult. It's just energetically uphill. Undoing entropy costs energy. Second Law of Thermodynamics.

Exactly, desalination is very popular in arid countries. With renewable prices trending down, it's getting cheaper too. Basically, don't use consumer grid prices because those still include a fat profit margin for the energy suppliers and their sunk investment in legacy expensive generation using gas, coal, or nuclear. If you are within 40 degrees of the equator, which is where you'd find most arid places, solar is a very good option for generating lots of energy cheaply. Cents per kwh basically, possibly dipping below 1 cent per kwh in the not so distant future. And since you can store water in reservoirs, it's OK to not be desalinating 24x7.

A thousand liters takes about 3kwh. It's not really that expensive. If you run a very inefficient house in the US, that's actually what you'd need per day. You might consider some cost/water saving solutions if that worries you. But, either way, we're talking cents per day per household basically.

Not nothing. But cheap enough that it is a common solution to get water in places that have average incomes far below those common in places like the US where desalination is mostly science fiction.

Re: Why is desalination so difficult?

#29
Relatively high energy cost since you’re undoing an endothermic reaction, you need to do a lot of it since we use water in large quantities… but most of all, the planet naturally does a lot of desalination for us already through various geological processes, so our “price point” for desalination is $0 per liter (infrastructure to capture rain, dam rivers, or tap groundwater isn’t literally free, but it’s pretty close - especially when it comes to the marginal cost for the next liter). It’s not difficult to desalinate per se, it’s difficult to desalinate extremely cheaply and at huge scale.

Re: Why is desalination so difficult?

#30
Stupid question time, why not expose the sea water over a larger area and expose to sunshine? There's plenty of room in the UAE for this, somebody is even building a wall that could hold the water which could be dual purpose and act as cooling via evaporation...
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