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High prices make textbook ‘piracy’ acceptable to most students

torrentfreak.com

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Re: High prices make textbook ‘piracy’ acceptable to most students

#21
post #18

Culprits are always the instructors/professors who teach courses. Aren't they happy with their salaries? How much royalty do these instructors get from selling $200 textbook to their students? These professors should be ashamed of themselves in involving this scammy behavior, while at the same time these unethical/immoral professors ask their students to sign honor code.

I'm not a professor, just a full time instructor, but my salary is 40% what I'd make in industry. But it's worth it for the great health insurance and 4 months off per year. And for the fact that teaching is what I love.

The salary is frankly embarrassing to share with my peers in industry.

But not all of us take it out on the students. I find free books whenever I can for my courses. I even write books and let the students (and everyone) freely use them. If there are good for-profit books out there, I only use them if they're cheap and something useful beyond college.

I got it from Dad, who was also a teacher. He got tired of book prices and wrote his own. Students still had to buy it, but they could do so at cost at the college print shop. Dad made no money from it.

Re: High prices make textbook ‘piracy’ acceptable to most students

#23

Here's a weird idea. Bundle materials into tuition expenses. It incentivizes the right people with the power and market participation to optimize for the right thing. Presumably, teachers and departments would have to justify costs from a materials budget to an admin forcing real downward pressure on the textbook market. The current state of textbooks acts like a surprise fee(dark pattern) where you purchase a produc…

Bundled prices and and a lack of price visibility often promote extortionate pricing, bribes, etc.

The value of the current arrangement is students can't ignore the prices.

I'd bet a nice lunch that if books were part of tuition, the net dollars flowing to publishers would increase.

Re: High prices make textbook ‘piracy’ acceptable to most students

#24

Besides bleak job market, horrible healthcare, being potential homeless due to skyhigh housing cost, stark contrast to the boomer's easy life, the more extreme weathers and the climate change, textbook is probably an afterthought. It's not even in top 10 things to worry about

Millennials have more money than boomers did at the same age. There was no "boomer's easy life." That's a myth. https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2023/05/millenn...

Re: High prices make textbook ‘piracy’ acceptable to most students

#25
It’s so much worse than you think.

Many textbooks come with license keys specifically so you can’t buy used books anymore.

Students who do buy a used book are typically coerced into buying the license key to do digital homework, or whatever other reason.

When I was teaching during a graduate fellowship I accepted paper assignments for students who bought used books, or who shared books with other students. The Pearson representative complained and I was given a talking to by the graduate student dean about consistency or some such nonsense. Eventually I would be reassigned to teach classes that didn’t involve digital components.

We called it the textbook industrial complex.

Re: High prices make textbook ‘piracy’ acceptable to most students

#26
post #18

Culprits are always the instructors/professors who teach courses. Aren't they happy with their salaries? How much royalty do these instructors get from selling $200 textbook to their students? These professors should be ashamed of themselves in involving this scammy behavior, while at the same time these unethical/immoral professors ask their students to sign honor code.

Nah, almost never. That is usually forced by the university, publishers and, surprisingly, by the students and their parents:

Say the textbook used for the last 5 years costs $300 and now you want to switch to a different, cheaper book. Now you have to convince admin (why switch? The previous one works) and students (I pay $$$ tuition, why are you cheaping out on the book? Is it worse?).

> how much royalty do they get?

Basically nothing, so that is obviously not the reason and you should be ashamed of yourself for suggesting that.

Re: High prices make textbook ‘piracy’ acceptable to most students

#27

Here's a weird idea. Bundle materials into tuition expenses. It incentivizes the right people with the power and market participation to optimize for the right thing. Presumably, teachers and departments would have to justify costs from a materials budget to an admin forcing real downward pressure on the textbook market. The current state of textbooks acts like a surprise fee(dark pattern) where you purchase a produc…

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but this feels like it'll cause even more issues. Today, clever students can share books, buy used, share electronic copies, or skip the book entirely if they don't think it's necessary. With this system, every student is forced to buy their textbook indirectly through tuition, which will of course rise significantly based on the cost of a textbook for an average class.

It's kind of like meal plans: when I went to college, meal plans were priced horribly, but you were forced to pay for at least a base meal plan, even if you lived off campus. It was just another way for the college to make money off of students who had no other choice. When meal plan prices rose $100 in a single year, or the college eliminated the previous cheapest meal plan, it's not like any students are going to transfer over a couple hundred dollars a semester. But it still sucked. Seems to me like bundling doesn't solve issues, it just reduces transparency and results in more "hidden fees" that might not show up in standard tuition costs.

Re: High prices make textbook ‘piracy’ acceptable to most students

#28
Won’t things like blanket student loan forgiveness or very cheap student loans make such moral hazards even worse? Publishers, college administrators, football coaches, etc. will try to extract as much as possible from the free student loans provided by the government.

Re: High prices make textbook ‘piracy’ acceptable to most students

#29

Here's a weird idea. Bundle materials into tuition expenses. It incentivizes the right people with the power and market participation to optimize for the right thing. Presumably, teachers and departments would have to justify costs from a materials budget to an admin forcing real downward pressure on the textbook market. The current state of textbooks acts like a surprise fee(dark pattern) where you purchase a produc…

That's exactly what we were doing at a previous employer. It was called "Equitable Access"

https://get.vitalsource.com/vitalsource-advantage/equitable-...

Re: High prices make textbook ‘piracy’ acceptable to most students

#30

Here's a weird idea. Bundle materials into tuition expenses. It incentivizes the right people with the power and market participation to optimize for the right thing. Presumably, teachers and departments would have to justify costs from a materials budget to an admin forcing real downward pressure on the textbook market. The current state of textbooks acts like a surprise fee(dark pattern) where you purchase a produc…

Freshman year, first semester, I paid $1100 for books, and then we only actually used one of them more than slightly. I still have them all. One of them was a Discrete Mathematics book that cost $250. We used it twice to do a "reading assignment" and since the class was only taught by the teacher who wanted this book just this one semester, the school store wouldn't buy it back at the end of the semester. It still cr…

Wouldn't it be fair use if the class just copied content for those two assignments? It is using only small portion of the whole thing after all.
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