Is Therapy-Speak Making Us Selfish? • Hacker News Board

Re: Is Therapy-Speak Making Us Selfish?

#21

Post by smoldesu » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:29 PM UTC

bitsinthesky wrote: post #19

It surprises me that anyone can defend using speech distorted with such euphemistic, and even worse imprecise, language when dealing with another person. Respecting a person means transparency and simplicity. Allow the other person to interpret situations how they would, even if it's in a way you haven't molded. Playing with vague language that gives you the moral throne is a method of gas lighting. The applicable ex…

> What other purpose could such language have than to initiate a power play?

Well, let's put the ball back in your court: how would you rewrite that pizza party example to be less euphemistic and imprecise?

Frankly, the wording the guest used is direct and to-the-point. It's probably disarming/distressing to hear if you're the host, but it's not therapy speak. If someone tells you that you make them feel unsafe, you should probably resolve that. Responding with denial that you could have hurt someone's feelings is the dictionary definition of gaslighting.

Re: Is Therapy-Speak Making Us Selfish?

#22

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:39 PM UTC

eternityforest wrote: post #20

morkalork wrote: post #6

Therapy-speak is exhausting and patronizing and so are the people that use it, no thanks.

It's useful when you're dealing with an abuser or know someone who is. Other than that it's pretty exhausting. It's especially exhausting when someone is using it to hide the fact that they themselves are in fact, the abuser. The male feminist who's actually a rapist, the person "Working on themselves" and posting about going to therapy while continuing to do very awful things, etc.

[deleted]

Re: Is Therapy-Speak Making Us Selfish?

#23

Post by bitsinthesky » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 5:32 PM UTC

smoldesu wrote: post #21

bitsinthesky wrote: post #19

It surprises me that anyone can defend using speech distorted with such euphemistic, and even worse imprecise, language when dealing with another person. Respecting a person means transparency and simplicity. Allow the other person to interpret situations how they would, even if it's in a way you haven't molded. Playing with vague language that gives you the moral throne is a method of gas lighting. The applicable ex…

> What other purpose could such language have than to initiate a power play? Well, let's put the ball back in your court: how would you rewrite that pizza party example to be less euphemistic and imprecise? Frankly, the wording the guest used is direct and to-the-point. It's probably disarming/distressing to hear if you're the host, but it's not therapy speak. If someone tells you that you make them feel unsafe, you…

I think better would be ignored and disrespected, or even more correct, that they felt the other gave them a mean look and acted rudely. Or, just acted like a jerk. Unsafe and unloved are incorrect and obfuscating.

Re: Is Therapy-Speak Making Us Selfish?

#24

Post by likeclockwork » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 5:50 PM UTC

dragonwriter wrote: post #17

likeclockwork wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That phrasing makes her friend responsible for her feelings. It's an accusatory way of expressing one's emotional state. Nothing straight forward or honest about that. It's pure manipulation and I don't see why her friend wouldn't become defensive upon hearing that.

> That phrasing makes her friend responsible for her feelings. Expressing the speakers understanding of the impact that listener had on their emotional state so that it can be addressed is the point of the expression (which is not in exactly the optimum recommended form, but that’s a side issue), so that’s not at all an unintended result. > It’s an accusatory way of expressing one’s emotional state. It’s not a way of…

It IS a way of expressing one's emotional state. Perhaps one's emotional state is a relationship problem but causation has to be demonstrated.

Misunderstandings happen all the time. Sometimes people are in a fragile emotional state or have an "eggshell psyche". Goodwill doesn't grow on trees.

The form "you made me feel X" starts from the premise that the listener somehow assumed direct control over the speaker's emotional state and turned the dial setting them to feel terrible. That's not causation, unless you believe in magic.

The person who's feelings are injured has a responsibility not to make other people responsible for their emotional state. Their feelings don't just automatically create responsibilities in others. What kind of standard would that be?

Re: Is Therapy-Speak Making Us Selfish?

#25

Post by smoldesu » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 6:59 PM UTC

likeclockwork wrote: post #24

dragonwriter wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That phrasing makes her friend responsible for her feelings. Expressing the speakers understanding of the impact that listener had on their emotional state so that it can be addressed is the point of the expression (which is not in exactly the optimum recommended form, but that’s a side issue), so that’s not at all an unintended result. > It’s an accusatory way of expressing one’s emotional state. It’s not a way of…

It IS a way of expressing one's emotional state. Perhaps one's emotional state is a relationship problem but causation has to be demonstrated. Misunderstandings happen all the time. Sometimes people are in a fragile emotional state or have an "eggshell psyche". Goodwill doesn't grow on trees. The form "you made me feel X" starts from the premise that the listener somehow assumed direct control over the speaker's emot…

Would the situation be any different if 2 or 3 guests came to the host and said they felt unsafe?

A lot of people in this thread are focused on questioning the guest's psyche and discrediting their reaction. Yes, people control their reaction to bad events. However, if you spend an entire evening being racist/sexist/somethingist, even inadvertently, then people will likely blame you for their reaction. There are a lot of dinner topics that would make me feel unsafe, and it's not hard to see how that would make someone feel unloved or ostracized.

So, the volley of blame continues. Instead of showing humility and mutually acknowledging that neither of you care about the problem, we need to write a Bustle.com article to absolve ourselves and extend the conversation into "therapy speech".

Regardless of who is right and wrong, this article promotes childish escalation over common understanding. It's such a ridiculous fallacy that it poisons the topic it actually wants to discuss, which is the impact of impersonal rhetoric between friends.