Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

VPN Users Risk 20-Year Jail Sentences in the US Under New Restrict Act

beincrypto.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 44 posts

Re: VPN Users Risk 20-Year Jail Sentences in the US Under New Restrict Act

#21

Post by gruez »

justizin wrote: post #14
gruez wrote: post #13

Which specific part of the bill allows "VPN users" to be punished with "20 year jail sentences"? Does the bill even ban VPNs? I skimmed the article and the linked tweet and can't find anything to that effect. The closest I can find is this >This could include VPNs if they are used to access banned websites such as TikTok. which seems like a standard anti-evasion provision. They're not going after your VPNs, people. W…

you think it’s reasonable to put someone in jail for 20 years for logging into a social media website? also: how are they going to determine that you did? what if you have malware on one of your devices and it accesses something banned?

>also: how are they going to determine that you did?

Same as any crime. They have to prove that you did it (both that you did the act, and that you intended to do the act) to a judge or a jury beyond a reasonable doubt.

> what if you have malware on one of your devices and it accesses something banned?

If your concern is about being framed via malware, there are plenty of existing ways of doing so. eg. laws against CSAM or laws against funding terrorists (hope that the malware doesn't use your paypal session to send money to ISIS!).

Re: VPN Users Risk 20-Year Jail Sentences in the US Under New Restrict Act

#22

Post by [deleted] »

TravelTechGuy wrote: post #12
anigbrowl wrote: post #3

This is wildly hyperbolic as far as I can see. The bill (which I do not endorse) is focused on threats to critical infrastructure and other natsec considerations from designated foreign enemies. Also, it's just been introduced and might not go anywhere.

How to pass horrible bills: 1. Stuff them with truly horrible ideas. 2. Wait for public to scream. 3. Remove half of the horrible ideas (keeping the core crap, like no FOIAs, privacy violations etc.) hidden and spread amongst hundreds of subparagraphs. 4. Present this is as "fair compromise". Convince idiots from both sides of the aisle that this is good for national security. 5. Pass the law. 6. Profit?

[deleted]

Re: VPN Users Risk 20-Year Jail Sentences in the US Under New Restrict Act

#23

Post by skoopie »

13years wrote: post #2

We need to ban TikTok because they might be spying on you. Solution: a bill that allows us to spy on you unconditionally for all activities, anywhere, anytime for any reason. Also, we will be immune to FOIA or any kind of oversight.

Who TF cares if they're spying on us. The real issue is that our biggest foreign adversary has push-button access to influence the minds of our kids. If TikTok were Russia-owned, we would have banned it already.

Re: VPN Users Risk 20-Year Jail Sentences in the US Under New Restrict Act

#24

Post by fsociety999 »

gruez wrote: post #13

Which specific part of the bill allows "VPN users" to be punished with "20 year jail sentences"? Does the bill even ban VPNs? I skimmed the article and the linked tweet and can't find anything to that effect. The closest I can find is this >This could include VPNs if they are used to access banned websites such as TikTok. which seems like a standard anti-evasion provision. They're not going after your VPNs, people. W…

While I agree it is a bit of a clickbait headline, it is all about the precedent when it comes to this kind of thing. I think you are severely downplaying the risk here. Using vague language like that opens the door for them to crack down even harder.

The government wants to monitor everything people do online and VPNs give people a way to opt out of that surveillance. It is a typical legislative move to add extra provisions all in the name of “banning the evil, Chinese spy app”. There is no reason to believe this will stop at TikTok. What if people use VPNs to get around other censorship that may or may not exist now? What if people use VPNs to access content using BitTorrent? Who is to say they won’t crack down on that that stuff next?

Governments love to take advantage of situations to expand their control think about what happened after 9/11.

Apparently this is exactly what is going on here: https://twitter.com/Fynnderella1/status/1640016692305711105

Re: VPN Users Risk 20-Year Jail Sentences in the US Under New Restrict Act

#26

Post by Bud »

ori_b wrote: post #10
anigbrowl wrote: post #3

This is wildly hyperbolic as far as I can see. The bill (which I do not endorse) is focused on threats to critical infrastructure and other natsec considerations from designated foreign enemies. Also, it's just been introduced and might not go anywhere.

> Also, it's just been introduced and might not go anywhere. The way to prevent it from going somewhere is by raising the alarm loudly. Possibly also by lobbying for legislation that enshrines existing rights.

[dead]

Re: VPN Users Risk 20-Year Jail Sentences in the US Under New Restrict Act

#27

Post by IronWolve »

Basically turns the department of commerce into the equivalent of the DHS, which already does the key aspects of the act, with some NEW special powers. If they think your company is a threat, they can close you down. But only foreign threats, just like the Patriot Act was sold to ya.

It will be interesting to see the new rules the commerce department puts in place to monitor and control the internet. For your safety of course.

Re: VPN Users Risk 20-Year Jail Sentences in the US Under New Restrict Act

#28

Post by eaurouge »

anigbrowl wrote: post #3

This is wildly hyperbolic as far as I can see. The bill (which I do not endorse) is focused on threats to critical infrastructure and other natsec considerations from designated foreign enemies. Also, it's just been introduced and might not go anywhere.

I haven't read the bill.

But, "critical infrastructure", "natsec considerations", "foreign enemies", are such vague terms, that could be stretched to cover all sorts of unforeseen circumstances.

Re: VPN Users Risk 20-Year Jail Sentences in the US Under New Restrict Act

#29

Post by gruez »

fsociety999 wrote: post #24
gruez wrote: post #13

Which specific part of the bill allows "VPN users" to be punished with "20 year jail sentences"? Does the bill even ban VPNs? I skimmed the article and the linked tweet and can't find anything to that effect. The closest I can find is this >This could include VPNs if they are used to access banned websites such as TikTok. which seems like a standard anti-evasion provision. They're not going after your VPNs, people. W…

While I agree it is a bit of a clickbait headline, it is all about the precedent when it comes to this kind of thing. I think you are severely downplaying the risk here. Using vague language like that opens the door for them to crack down even harder. The government wants to monitor everything people do online and VPNs give people a way to opt out of that surveillance. It is a typical legislative move to add extra pr…

>I think you are severely downplaying the risk here. Using vague language like that opens the door for them to crack down even harder.

>The government wants to monitor everything people do online and VPNs give people a way to opt out of that surveillance. It is a typical legislative move to add extra provisions all in the name of “banning the evil, Chinese spy app”. There is no reason to believe this will stop at TikTok. What if people use VPNs to get around other censorship? What if people use VPNs to access copyrighted content using BitTorrent? Who is to say that they won’t crack down on that that stuff next?

I'm not downplaying the risk of the bill, only pointing out the rhetoric is false and misleading. Based on the tweets and the article there aren't any anti-VPN or anti-anti-censorship tool provisions in the bill. Now, you can still argue that passing this bill sets us on a slippery slope to get encrypted chats banned or whatever, but it's dishonest to say that people are facing "20 year jail sentences" for using VPNs when they're not. Pointing that out isn't "severely downplaying the risk ".

Re: VPN Users Risk 20-Year Jail Sentences in the US Under New Restrict Act

#30

Post by peepeepoopoo3 »

IronWolve wrote: post #27

Basically turns the department of commerce into the equivalent of the DHS, which already does the key aspects of the act, with some NEW special powers. If they think your company is a threat, they can close you down. But only foreign threats, just like the Patriot Act was sold to ya. It will be interesting to see the new rules the commerce department puts in place to monitor and control the internet. For your safety…

"Foreign" here isn't necessarily tied to citizenship. They can reclassify US citizens as "foreign threats" as they see fit.
Post reply on HN