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Is My MacBook Pro Always Listening?

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Re: Is My MacBook Pro Always Listening?

#21

Post by Tyrannosaurs »

thinkling wrote: post #17

When you plug a microphone device (e.g. a headphones/mic combo that comes with the iPhone) into the single audio port on a recent Macbook, it will be detected and the control panel will switch to giving you settings for "External microphone". The internal microphone no longer shows up, suggesting it is disabled as before. Thus, the simple plug hack should still work. (I'm running Lion on a MBP8,1.)

Suggesting it is disabled isn't the same as it being disabled.

Reducing the input level to zero suggests it's disabled but evidently this isn't the case.

Re: Is My MacBook Pro Always Listening?

#22

Post by mchanson »

This article is without merit. The author's logic train derails shortly after leaving the station.

Without removing the hardware there is no way to prevent someone with remote root access from recording audio from any input regardless of settings. This is true of any machine that has audio inputs and drivers loaded for those devices.

Re: Is My MacBook Pro Always Listening?

#24

Post by thinkling »

Tyrannosaurs wrote: post #21
thinkling wrote: post #17

When you plug a microphone device (e.g. a headphones/mic combo that comes with the iPhone) into the single audio port on a recent Macbook, it will be detected and the control panel will switch to giving you settings for "External microphone". The internal microphone no longer shows up, suggesting it is disabled as before. Thus, the simple plug hack should still work. (I'm running Lion on a MBP8,1.)

Suggesting it is disabled isn't the same as it being disabled. Reducing the input level to zero suggests it's disabled but evidently this isn't the case.

That's why I phrased it exactly like that. :)

I would imagine (yes, I'm speculating) that the control panel uses a standard OS interface to enumerate audio devices, and when the internal microphone drops off the list in the dialog, that reflects the fact the OS isn't offering it anymore. So an app asking the OS to enumerate audio devices would not find the internal microphone.

It's always possible that there's a lower-level hack to get around that, but then that's always been a concern.

By the way, I forgot to mention that when I turn my input level down to zero, the little blue bars stop showing any signal. The blog post is about 10.6 (Snow Leopard), as mentioned below the Control Panel snapshot. Maybe this is all fixed in 10.7 (Lion)?

Re: Is My MacBook Pro Always Listening?

#25

Post by dkissell »

mchanson wrote: post #22

This article is without merit. The author's logic train derails shortly after leaving the station. Without removing the hardware there is no way to prevent someone with remote root access from recording audio from any input regardless of settings. This is true of any machine that has audio inputs and drivers loaded for those devices.

Agreed, I would also urge the author to look for more accredited sources to fuel his infosec paranoia than GQ magazine. David Kusher certainly earned his pay that month.

Re: Is My MacBook Pro Always Listening?

#26

Post by nthnclrk »

Without further investigation, I pose a potentially naive question:

What evidence is there that this behaviour of the internal mic is the same when the Audio preferences pane is not open?

Could it be that the mic is automatically made 'live' when system preferences or that particular pref pane is opened?

Re: Is My MacBook Pro Always Listening?

#27

Post by _delirium »

mikecane wrote: post #5

What about putting a wee piece of tape over the mic hole?

Newer MacBooks don't have a separate microphone hole anymore; the mic is now located under the left speaker grille. You'd either have to tape over the whole thing (it's a pretty big grille), or open up the machine to cover/detach the mic specifically.

Re: Is My MacBook Pro Always Listening?

#28

Post by maukdaddy »

Aqua_Geek wrote: post #10
PedroCandeias wrote: post #3

Even with a "mute" checkbox, it stands to reason that a hack that grants access to the mic will also at least attempt to bypass the "mute" setting. So, without a hardware solution, there's no real way to secure the mics on these macbooks. Personally I'm not that worried, but I can see why this could be a problem for some.

Exactly. I was going to suggest using something like Soundflower to create a fake sound input device, but at the end of the day it's still a software thing that can be overridden. If you're really paranoid, you could always remove the mic with a soldering iron... =)

That's exactly what's done with cameras and microphones in high-security environments.

Re: Is My MacBook Pro Always Listening?

#29

Post by jrockway »

If you are really worried about this, I recommend surgery. I used to have this Windows box at work that would always make sounds for no reason, even though the sound was muted. The solution was to open it up and physically disconnect the speaker. Never made a sound again.

If you don't want your computer to be used as a listening device, first try adjusting your tinfoil hat. If you're still worried, open it up and remove the speakers and microphones. Make sure you get them all! Though I'm sure someone can figure out how to make a hard drive into a microphone, so you'd better replace that with an SSD. Also get the camera while you're in there.

There. Now you just have to worry about the bugs the Agents put all over your house.

Re: Is My MacBook Pro Always Listening?

#30

Post by Terc »

Finding a single regression in a defense in depth strategy does not an exploit make. Software can select whichever input it wants, regardless of whatever settings you may have set. This is one of many things that are simply a best effort to protect the computer. Root access or even access as an Administrative user could bypass this setting easily.
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