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EU chat control law will ban open source operating systems

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Re: EU chat control law will ban open source operating systems

#21

Post by agilob »

sendfoods wrote: post #9

I am the first person to appreciate the pro-online-privacy legislation from the EU in the last couple of years. Yet...How can the same organization be behind this? Is it a result of the sheer size of the org, with malevolent people reeking their ugly heads? A more cynical "privacy legislation as a smoke screen with totalitarian measures in the backend"?

>Yet...How can the same organization be behind this?

Very easy. The organisation is huge and composed from 100000s of people working on different goals. They don't have any supervision, no democratic vote and if they decided they want to grow 400% in one year, they simply could and would, because no one feels like EU is "their government" they could easily protest against. If they want to create EU-Online-Child-Safety-Agency, they would just take our tax money and create it. What could you do against it? Shitpost online that you don't like it? It's too big and broad to control by citizens.

Re: EU chat control law will ban open source operating systems

#22

Post by Semaphor »

maxehmookau wrote: post #8

I'm curious to know how likely this is to pass. EU laws are proposed by the council, but passed by the (much more representative and democratic) parliament. The EU has fairly good form in terms of passing common-sense tech laws (see; GDPR) so I'd be skeptical that this is any more than a dumb proposal destined for failure.

I agree with you, but outcries as these are needed to make it clear how bad the law is.

Re: EU chat control law will ban open source operating systems

#23

Post by mort96 »

narrowtux wrote: post #4

I'm so tired of it all. Countless times it has been tried to enact laws like this. And it's not just this surveillance law that depresses me, reading up on the cyber resilience act just feels to me like it will suck even more fun out of software development, at least in a professional context.

This isn't in relation to either the chat control law or the cyber resilience act, I haven't read either proposal in enough detail to have a strong opinion on them. But I want to comment on the "sucking the fun out of professional software development" part.

Should we expect professional software development to be fun? There's a lot of laws out there which arguably "suck the fun out of" civil engineering, but I certainly appreciate the fact that there are standards in place to try to keep bridges, tunnels and buildings from collapsing.

Maybe it's not the worst idea in the world to have enforced engineering standards for the digital built environment like we have for the non-digital built environment, and treat it less like a playground where programmers can do whatever they want?

Just a thought, I don't have very strong opinions on this topic.

Re: EU chat control law will ban open source operating systems

#24

Post by pmontra »

closewith wrote: post #15
narrowtux wrote: post #4

I'm so tired of it all. Countless times it has been tried to enact laws like this. And it's not just this surveillance law that depresses me, reading up on the cyber resilience act just feels to me like it will suck even more fun out of software development, at least in a professional context.

> And it's not just this surveillance law that depresses me, reading up on the cyber resilience act just feels to me like it will suck even more fun out of software development, at least in a professional context. God forbid people who love to use the title engineer will have to apply the rigour and standards of actual engineering to the work they do.

Or get a degree in engineering.

Re: EU chat control law will ban open source operating systems

#25

Post by agilob »

voidwtf wrote: post #2

Seems high time for some civil disobedience. Break the law collectively, let them seek to enforce their ridiculous/draconian laws and explain the knock on effects in court. Alternatively, open source projects that may be effected can withdraw access to their sites and source code and cite the law. Hopefully they forked the code already and don’t need any future updates.

>Seems high time for some civil disobedience.

First time ACTA was presented there were protests mostly in Poland. 2nd time it was presented there were protests in Poland, Czech and Germany. 3rd time... it just passed. No one cared to protest again.

Re: EU chat control law will ban open source operating systems

#27

Post by DiabloD3 »

No offense, but that just means the EU will no longer be compatible with FOSS. FOSS runs the world, and Europe will find themselves without software to run the majority of their systems.

Without FOSS? No Internet. No business. No nothing. You'll have maybe 2/3rds of what ships in Windows and less than half of OSX. Oh, and no Ingenuity, which iirc was a joint NASA/ESA project.

Re: EU chat control law will ban open source operating systems

#28

Post by flangola7 »

narrowtux wrote: post #4

I'm so tired of it all. Countless times it has been tried to enact laws like this. And it's not just this surveillance law that depresses me, reading up on the cyber resilience act just feels to me like it will suck even more fun out of software development, at least in a professional context.

>cyber resilience act

In my brief reading I don't see any problems or privacy implications stemming from it. What about it are you referring to?

Re: EU chat control law will ban open source operating systems

#29

Post by mantas »

noduerme wrote: post #5

It seems that application stores would only be a tiny fragment of what would be affected by the law. Basically everything involving facilitating communications between users would be subject to draconian surveillance and reporting requirements. This is not the way a free or open society progresses.

EU is neither free nor open. I'm saying this as a citizen of EU member. It's getting more and more pro-big-business and pro-big-government day by day. While citizen self-governance is crushed over and over.

Good example is Poland vs EU conflict for political control of judges. Meanwhile nobody bats an eye for existing political control of judges in my country. Here higher level judges have to be approved by parliament. Currently parliament speaker is a leader of a party that is trialed for corruption. This party is in ruling coalition as well. So the party that is in trial also makes a call who can work as a judge. Yet there's zero complains about that :)

Re: EU chat control law will ban open source operating systems

#30

Post by timeon »

mantas wrote: post #14
sendfoods wrote: post #9

I am the first person to appreciate the pro-online-privacy legislation from the EU in the last couple of years. Yet...How can the same organization be behind this? Is it a result of the sheer size of the org, with malevolent people reeking their ugly heads? A more cynical "privacy legislation as a smoke screen with totalitarian measures in the backend"?

Both pro-privacy and anti-privacy have one common theme - more power to the state. And that's the point of EU bureaucrats. To gather as much power in their fight against both outside forces (e.g. US-based multinationals) and inside forces (member states).

You really think those various actors are part of one plot?

Also this is proposed not passed law. But you already have conclusion about whole org.

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