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How to Build an Exchange (2017)

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Re: How to Build an Exchange (2017)

#21

Post by kennend3 »

jrockway wrote: post #19
kennend3 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One difference is Google, etc are all doing massive layoffs and i doubt JS, Citadel, etc will do this.

Where is Google doing layoffs? The latest news I have is that people are very worried about layoffs, but so far they've only started putting people on rebranded PIPs. The other FAANGs are definitely laying people off, though. I personally think the recession is a self-fulfilling prophecy, but regardless of my take on the fundamentals, it is certainly fulfilling itself and everyone in tech should be pretty worried rig…

you are correct, it has not happened yet, but you willing to bet it wont in the next 6 months?

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/google-employees-brace...

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/12/22/google-tells-employees-highe...

Re: How to Build an Exchange (2017)

#22

Post by kennend3 »

nequo wrote: post #15
kennend3 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One difference is Google, etc are all doing massive layoffs and i doubt JS, Citadel, etc will do this.

Note though that Citadel is reputed to have a turnover rate of 100% per year. Their layoffs take care of themselves.

This!

My personal background is a "well known hedge fund" and the turnover there was rather high.

Many quit because it wasn't "a good fit".

Re: How to Build an Exchange (2017)

#23

Post by selectodude »

nequo wrote: post #18
selectodude wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those are low numbers compared to the smaller prop shops that routinely pay 1MM+. Gotta have a PhD in pure math though. That shit is bananas.

Do you have a source on the $1mn+ figure? I would be curious to read more about this.

I mean, not really. This is personal knowledge. You can't really look up salaries because the base is like $175k but even in mediocre years they're getting high six-figures in bonus.

Take a peek at what Wolverine, Radix, or Jump are paying new grads though. It's generally like $500k+. Even Jane Street, which is a larger place that hires people who aren't published mathematicians (see: Sam Bankman-Fried) pays $750k

Re: How to Build an Exchange (2017)

#24

Post by caddemon »

paxys wrote: post #11
Zaheer wrote: post #7

Fun fact: Jane Street, Citadel and other HFT firms pay exorbitantly. You can see the base salary ($200-300k) posted public here: https://www.janestreet.com/join-jane-street/position/4274288... Even interns make $120/hr: https://www.levels.fyi/internships/

They do pay extremely well, but are also very selective. The kind of talent they are looking for can earn similar salaries at large tech companies like Google ($400K-500K TC is pretty common at staff+ levels).

They do a lot of hiring out of school though, so they are selective but if you make the cut you'd definitely be earning more at the start of your career. Plus if you perform well you can make well over 500K TC by the time you would have been promoted to staff at FAANG, because of bonuses.

Re: How to Build an Exchange (2017)

#25

Post by ackbar03 »

samwillis wrote: post #2

The context here is that Sam Bankman-Fried of FTX and a number of the other executives (Caroline Ellison and Brett Harrison) were previously traders at Jane Street. This video is from 2017, a couple of years prior to the FTX launch. It makes you wander if any of them were in attendance.

Sbf was playing LoL at the same time

Re: How to Build an Exchange (2017)

#26

Post by mmiyer »

paxys wrote: post #17
kennend3 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One difference is Google, etc are all doing massive layoffs and i doubt JS, Citadel, etc will do this.

Smaller companies do layoffs as well. They just aren't as highly publicized as those at tech giants. Severance packages are usually worse/nonexistent as well. HFT companies also have much higher performance bars and rates of overwork/burnout. I'm willing to bet that people are leaving Jane Street, Citadel etc. (whether voluntarily or not) at much higher rates than large tech companies like Google.

True of Citadel, but Jane Street is supposed to have a solid wlb, and because of the high pay and the few companies willing to pay at that level, people generally stick around there. These kind of finance companies also do better in volatility so they're definitely not laying off right now.

Re: How to Build an Exchange (2017)

#27

Post by caddemon »

paxys wrote: post #17
kennend3 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One difference is Google, etc are all doing massive layoffs and i doubt JS, Citadel, etc will do this.

Smaller companies do layoffs as well. They just aren't as highly publicized as those at tech giants. Severance packages are usually worse/nonexistent as well. HFT companies also have much higher performance bars and rates of overwork/burnout. I'm willing to bet that people are leaving Jane Street, Citadel etc. (whether voluntarily or not) at much higher rates than large tech companies like Google.

Jane Street does much better at retention than Citadel and probably many other quant firms. The performance bar is definitely higher than the average at Google but it's not like there is no WLB either.

Because they are more selective about fit to begin with I wouldn't be surprised if JS has better yearly retention than most FAANGs. People seem to hop between different big tech cos quite a bit (pre hiring freezes anyway).

Re: How to Build an Exchange (2017)

#28

Post by DWqRdped »

paxys wrote: post #11
Zaheer wrote: post #7

Fun fact: Jane Street, Citadel and other HFT firms pay exorbitantly. You can see the base salary ($200-300k) posted public here: https://www.janestreet.com/join-jane-street/position/4274288... Even interns make $120/hr: https://www.levels.fyi/internships/

They do pay extremely well, but are also very selective. The kind of talent they are looking for can earn similar salaries at large tech companies like Google ($400K-500K TC is pretty common at staff+ levels).

a high performer at citadel or JS can make 1m in 5 years. i don't know many people at google make that much.

Re: How to Build an Exchange (2017)

#29

Post by hermitdev »

nequo wrote: post #15
kennend3 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One difference is Google, etc are all doing massive layoffs and i doubt JS, Citadel, etc will do this.

Note though that Citadel is reputed to have a turnover rate of 100% per year. Their layoffs take care of themselves.

I spent 9 years there, left a decade ago. Turnover is high, but this is a gross exaggeration. It is stressful, and not everyone can hack it. I was there during and after the '05 layoff when roughly 2/3s of IT was cut. That's still the worst I've heard of from what I hear from friends that are still there.

Ken G definitely does the "Good to Great" getting the right people on the bus thing, which typically means the bottom 5-10% are cut, but even that was slowing before I left.

Re: How to Build an Exchange (2017)

#30

Post by smabie »

selectodude wrote: post #12
Zaheer wrote: post #7

Fun fact: Jane Street, Citadel and other HFT firms pay exorbitantly. You can see the base salary ($200-300k) posted public here: https://www.janestreet.com/join-jane-street/position/4274288... Even interns make $120/hr: https://www.levels.fyi/internships/

Those are low numbers compared to the smaller prop shops that routinely pay 1MM+. Gotta have a PhD in pure math though. That shit is bananas.

You don't need a PhD in pure math to get into these prop shops.

However they do sometimes pay !MM+

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