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I asked Signal motivations for SMS removal

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: I asked Signal motivations for SMS removal

#21

Post by joel35 »

With Signal moving away from SMS, the required messaging app stack on my phone just to be able to receive everything sent do me will have to be:

- Signal -> Close friends & family I've convinced to use it.

- WhatsApp -> Most of my friends.

- SMS -> School notifications, 2FA, shipping updates, etc.

- Facebook Messenger -> Elderly relatives

- Telegram -> That one relative who wants to use this instead of Signal.

Is there a consolidated messaging app that the HN community recommends?

I can't be the only one suffering from messenger bloat.

Re: I asked Signal motivations for SMS removal

#22

Post by modo_mario »

apexalpha wrote: post #20

I think you're forgetting the main reason: the group of people using it to communicate is really small and shrinking every year. The only large group of people who still primarily use SMS to communicate person-to-person is Android users in the USA. Every other country has settled on either Telegram, WeChat, WhatsApp or FB Messenger, or other niche apps. These apps work on both iOS and Android and often also Windows.…

SMS is still rather common here in Europe. Even if a ton of people use whatsapp and such SMS is often a safe option to initiate with or something trough which you get certain kinds of automated messages like appointment reminders or verification codes.

Re: I asked Signal motivations for SMS removal

#24

Post by iamevn »

> Just choose the one with the best layout or usability

This was Signal for me. I understand the reasons to get rid of SMS support but I strongly disagree. Unfortunately I don't have enough people in my life on Signal to justify keeping it around as yet another messaging app.

Re: I asked Signal motivations for SMS removal

#25

Post by robobro »

joel35 wrote: post #21

With Signal moving away from SMS, the required messaging app stack on my phone just to be able to receive everything sent do me will have to be: - Signal -> Close friends & family I've convinced to use it. - WhatsApp -> Most of my friends. - SMS -> School notifications, 2FA, shipping updates, etc. - Facebook Messenger -> Elderly relatives - Telegram -> That one relative who wants to use this instead of Signal. Is the…

Matrix

Re: I asked Signal motivations for SMS removal

#26

Post by phh »

captainmuon wrote: post #3

Tangential, but to 1.: Isn't RCS just built upon TCP/IP and SIP? Why can't you just implement it in user space? Or does it need to send some magic packets through the modem? It is really hard to find details on the protocol.

Yes, TCP/ip and SIP, no magic packet, but: 1. You need to do challenges with the SIM card for authentication 2. On most carriers, "ims" is on a special IPv6 data connection that can't be used by apps.

The specifications are public, but yeah it requires a lot of work to get into.

That being said, I think neither of those limitations apply to Google's "RCS" (which bypasses carriers, so they can't get their own IPv6 connection and I don't think they can use SIM challenges for auth), so I think it should be possible in a 3rd party app.

Re: I asked Signal motivations for SMS removal

#27

Post by Vinnl »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #18
bestouff wrote: post #6

That should have been written into the blog post. Not the current tasteless PR.

This is genuine; the PR messages are for businesses and shareholders; especially for publically traded companies, they have to be Very Careful with what they say in public.

Signal is not a publicly traded company and does not have shareholders; it's a non-profit.

Re: I asked Signal motivations for SMS removal

#28

Post by microtonal »

modo_mario wrote: post #22
apexalpha wrote: post #20

I think you're forgetting the main reason: the group of people using it to communicate is really small and shrinking every year. The only large group of people who still primarily use SMS to communicate person-to-person is Android users in the USA. Every other country has settled on either Telegram, WeChat, WhatsApp or FB Messenger, or other niche apps. These apps work on both iOS and Android and often also Windows.…

SMS is still rather common here in Europe. Even if a ton of people use whatsapp and such SMS is often a safe option to initiate with or something trough which you get certain kinds of automated messages like appointment reminders or verification codes.

I think that differs very much per country. The last time I have received an SMS from a human in NL must have been a decade ago. In many European countries, sending SMS was quite expensive, leading to early and very wide adoption of WhatsApp.

Re: I asked Signal motivations for SMS removal

#29

Post by jlund-molfese »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #17
edent wrote: post #9

SMS was, in my opinion, the killer feature for Signal. Telling people to install yet-another-inbox which was only going to be used by their one privacy-weirdo friend was a non-starter. Saying "this is a better SMS app" got people on-board and let them "upgrade" to secure messaging. That's why I started using it in the "TextSecure" days. But, sadly, I agree with Signal's reasoning here. Mixing the two protocols was an…

As a Dutch person, I'm still amazed that the US still seems to use SMS as much; mind you, our phone plans here were "you get 1000 text messages and X minutes or a bajillion megabytes of data"; that + 'free' international messaging / calls with services like Whatsapp quickly pushed people to data-only messaging like Whatsapp or maybe FB Messenger. We also have a big immigrant population that like to chat with their fa…

We do generally pay extra for international calls, though text messaging is often free (assuming you’re talking about international states. US states, of course, are all treated as the same country).

Almost all phone plans have unlimited (domestic) texting and calling and differentiate themselves with data, reliability and ”free” perks like subsidized Netflix. You really have to go out of your way to find a plan with limited texts/calls.

Re: I asked Signal motivations for SMS removal

#30

Post by jbverschoor »

joel35 wrote: post #21

With Signal moving away from SMS, the required messaging app stack on my phone just to be able to receive everything sent do me will have to be: - Signal -> Close friends & family I've convinced to use it. - WhatsApp -> Most of my friends. - SMS -> School notifications, 2FA, shipping updates, etc. - Facebook Messenger -> Elderly relatives - Telegram -> That one relative who wants to use this instead of Signal. Is the…

I never understood Telegram. It's insecure by default, runs in a different jurisdiction. It's not even anonymous

But somehow people started using it because it was "more secure" than whatsapp.

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