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I tried to add EV chargers to my rental property

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Re: I tried to add EV chargers to my rental property

#21

Post by socialismisok »

silisili wrote: post #6
bhhaskin wrote: post #3

This is one of the many reasons why I firmly believe that hydrogen hybrid are the future to replace gas vehicles. Charging at mass scale is just not feasible nor practical for most people. We can't even roll broadband out properly let alone the massive amounts of infrastructure required to deliver enough power to every home. That leaves centralized charging hubs which will quickly become overwhelmed and a massive tim…

Absolutely agreed. Electric cars are for the rich. And of course they say it's the future and everyone should do it, without realizing it's literally impossible. No grid in the US could come close to handling that, much less in developing countries. Not to mention due to range limitations, many people and companies are ruled out automatically. I don't think electric is bad, or should go away. But it's not meant for t…

Hydrogen is less energy per volume than gas, it requires pressure vessels rather than tanks, it's stored pressurized in vehicles and stations, it makes materials it contacts brittle, it relies on a manufacturing process that either requires natural gas production or a huge excess of electrical energy, fuel stations are huge capital costs, etc.

I could go on, but it just doesn't make sense to pin hopes on hydrogen.

Re: I tried to add EV chargers to my rental property

#22

Post by readthenotes1 »

avtolik wrote: post #14
silisili wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely agreed. Electric cars are for the rich. And of course they say it's the future and everyone should do it, without realizing it's literally impossible. No grid in the US could come close to handling that, much less in developing countries. Not to mention due to range limitations, many people and companies are ruled out automatically. I don't think electric is bad, or should go away. But it's not meant for t…

There are so many false statements in your post, I don't even know where to start. The grid absolutely can handle EVs. The range of modern EVs is totally fine for almost all cases. The price is an issue, but even in my poor Eastern European country the number of EV exploded this year. Mainly second hand small city cars, but also others.

"The grid absolutely can handle EVs."

Maybe yours can.

In California, they were recently asked to not charge cars during certain times of the day because the power system could not support the additional load.

My understanding is that California's grid could have supported the load, they just weren't able to generate the electricity required to do so.

Re: I tried to add EV chargers to my rental property

#23

Post by zizee »

socialismisok wrote: post #5
mjevans wrote: post #2

TL;DR improving a property triggers mandates like bringing the whole thing up to code (I'm personally OK with this generally) and also the potential to shoulder ore share costs to improve the surrounding infrastructure (I'm against this, it's similar to the problems broadband rollouts face when attaching to aging poles in that if they find an issue it's suddenly their problem to pay for). IMO the solution is top down…

Honestly, if you are renting out a unit as a landlord, you should be required to keep the property in compliance with code.

Sounds good, but just don't be surprised if this results in more expensive rents, and less affordable housing being built.

Re: I tried to add EV chargers to my rental property

#25

Post by cammikebrown »

socialismisok wrote: post #11
sschueller wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Grandfathering in electrical codes seems quite dangerous. At some point wouldn't the city just require it or deem the property unsafe?

I agree, especially if you are a landlord.

They don’t because (in places like California at least) their property taxes go up if they do any significant upgrades

Re: I tried to add EV chargers to my rental property

#26

Post by bhhaskin »

socialismisok wrote: post #10
bhhaskin wrote: post #3

This is one of the many reasons why I firmly believe that hydrogen hybrid are the future to replace gas vehicles. Charging at mass scale is just not feasible nor practical for most people. We can't even roll broadband out properly let alone the massive amounts of infrastructure required to deliver enough power to every home. That leaves centralized charging hubs which will quickly become overwhelmed and a massive tim…

Hydrogen isn't either. The real solution is to not have so many gas vehicles. There's also no reason we can't provide charging at destinations rather than homes. Workplaces, shopping centers, etc. Transit, trains, ebikes, etc. are all significantly more efficient, less polluting, and just better solutions all around.

This is simply not practical out side of large urban areas in the US. Not only is distance a factor but also weather. No one is going to be riding an Ebike in 10° winter weather, and a lot of people commute 60+ miles a day.

Not to mention that public transportation in a lot of areas can be... Let's just say perceived as unsafe.

Hydrogen (by itself) is as clean as it can be. The byproduct is water.

Re: I tried to add EV chargers to my rental property

#27

Post by janstice »

sschueller wrote: post #8
socialismisok wrote: post #4

"I'd have to bring my electrical systems up to code and that's expensive for my 80 year old house" Well, yeah. I suppose it would be. I'm a bit surprised this is a surprise to the landlord. Also, many of the costs here are looming anyways. It's a matter of when, not if, the electrical needs updating to meet code.

Grandfathering in electrical codes seems quite dangerous. At some point wouldn't the city just require it or deem the property unsafe?

In my neck of the woods, eventually your insurance will not cover you for damage caused by out of spec electrical wiring, which then endangers a mortgage…

Re: I tried to add EV chargers to my rental property

#28

Post by avtolik »

readthenotes1 wrote: post #22
avtolik wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are so many false statements in your post, I don't even know where to start. The grid absolutely can handle EVs. The range of modern EVs is totally fine for almost all cases. The price is an issue, but even in my poor Eastern European country the number of EV exploded this year. Mainly second hand small city cars, but also others.

"The grid absolutely can handle EVs." Maybe yours can. In California, they were recently asked to not charge cars during certain times of the day because the power system could not support the additional load. My understanding is that California's grid could have supported the load, they just weren't able to generate the electricity required to do so.

Almost all EV owners are charging them during the night, when the electricity demand is lower.

And ok, maybe some upgrades will be needed in some places. But the situation is not so dark as the person above described it.

Re: I tried to add EV chargers to my rental property

#29

Post by silisili »

readthenotes1 wrote: post #22
avtolik wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are so many false statements in your post, I don't even know where to start. The grid absolutely can handle EVs. The range of modern EVs is totally fine for almost all cases. The price is an issue, but even in my poor Eastern European country the number of EV exploded this year. Mainly second hand small city cars, but also others.

"The grid absolutely can handle EVs." Maybe yours can. In California, they were recently asked to not charge cars during certain times of the day because the power system could not support the additional load. My understanding is that California's grid could have supported the load, they just weren't able to generate the electricity required to do so.

Keep in mind, if my math is right, CA is at like 6% electric vehicle saturation. So basically multiply that load they claim not to be able to handle by 16.

Re: I tried to add EV chargers to my rental property

#30

Post by cycrutchfield »

readthenotes1 wrote: post #22
avtolik wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are so many false statements in your post, I don't even know where to start. The grid absolutely can handle EVs. The range of modern EVs is totally fine for almost all cases. The price is an issue, but even in my poor Eastern European country the number of EV exploded this year. Mainly second hand small city cars, but also others.

"The grid absolutely can handle EVs." Maybe yours can. In California, they were recently asked to not charge cars during certain times of the day because the power system could not support the additional load. My understanding is that California's grid could have supported the load, they just weren't able to generate the electricity required to do so.

The vast majority of home EV charging happens at night. Is that when CA was telling people not to charge their cars?
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