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The single market is looking wobbly

economist.com

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Re: The single market is looking wobbly

#21

Post by mmarq »

inglor_cz wrote: post #16
yrgulation wrote: post #4

“In case anyone felt their nose insufficiently rubbed in German success” All good things come to an end. Also it feels like if the weather will suck tomorrow it will be blamed on germany. Where are the other countries in all this? Taking a nap?

Germany was a huge winner from introduction of the Euro. Some other countries, especially the Latin bloc, cannot cope with the common currency. (Ironically, it was the German economists who used to be very skeptical against the common currency and were loud about it.) At the end of the day, the single market will only be popular if growth and prosperity are shared across the continent. If the economic periphery plagu…

The Latin block (Southern Europe??) countries joined the euro to cut their interest rates, and that happened.

The periphery is poor because it has been ruled by embarrassing governments for decades.

Re: The single market is looking wobbly

#23

Post by [deleted] »

deadbeefpatty wrote: post #19
chrisseaton wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder what motivation the British could have for saying that the EU's single market is looking wobbly?

This seems suspiciously close to an ad-hominem argument. The Economist is pro single market and advocated for remain ( https://www.economist.com/briefing/2016/02/27/the-brexit-del... )

[deleted]

Re: The single market is looking wobbly

#24

Post by MrPowers »

There is an excellent Real Life Lore video on "How Russia is Crippling Germany with Gas" that has quite a different take: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xi74gPrn24Y&ab_channel=RealL...

Peter Zeihan also has quite a different perspective.

> those in Europe’s biggest economy will be able to behave as if not much is going on

It seems like the shut down of the Nord Stream will have a big impact on German manufacturing. I'm not sure how they'll be able to "behave as it not much is going on".

Re: The single market is looking wobbly

#25

Post by manu_te »

luckydata wrote: post #13
chrisseaton wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder what motivation the British could have for saying that the EU's single market is looking wobbly?

I don't know about the economist but there's certain stipulations that went into the foundation of the single currency that favored Germany heavily, and Germany behaved the whole time like it didn't happen. Most of the european resentment comes from that fact. Most southern european countries were taken for a ride during those negotiations, and have paid (and continue to) a steep price. I was a strong believer in the…

France hasn't really benefited much. Italy has been the talking point for a long time and rightly so for the amount of debt plus the chronic political instability, but France is very much on a similar decline path.

Edit: cheap Russian gas + high productivity + political stability + undervalued currency (the Deutsche mark would have been way stronger than the euro) is what fueled German dominance in Europe. Italy/France/Spain/Greece/Portugal all struggled with varying degrees with low productivity, political instability (apart from France) and a currency that was too strong for their macro-economic fundamentals.

Re: The single market is looking wobbly

#26

Post by [deleted] »

mmarq wrote: post #21
inglor_cz wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germany was a huge winner from introduction of the Euro. Some other countries, especially the Latin bloc, cannot cope with the common currency. (Ironically, it was the German economists who used to be very skeptical against the common currency and were loud about it.) At the end of the day, the single market will only be popular if growth and prosperity are shared across the continent. If the economic periphery plagu…

The Latin block (Southern Europe??) countries joined the euro to cut their interest rates, and that happened. The periphery is poor because it has been ruled by embarrassing governments for decades.

[deleted]

Re: The single market is looking wobbly

#27

Post by anm89 »

juusto wrote: post #14

If I had one euro for every time The Economist has said that the Euro/EU were wobbly/breaking/etc I could balance Liz Truss'es budget and have money left for some fish'n'chips.

Well the Euro area has been an unmitigated disaster for more than a decade and could have fractured at multiple times during that period. It's prospects are terrible going forwards.

Geopolitics doesn't unfold at the pace of the 24 hour news cycle. Correct theories can play out in days, decades, or centuries. 10 years is a flash for these types of topics. Gloating that someone else was wrong on that time frame for Geopolitical events is not nearly as clever as it seems.

Re: The single market is looking wobbly

#28

Post by guerrilla »

systemvoltage wrote: post #10
guerrilla wrote: post #7

> Imagine queuing up at a food bank only for a millionaire to rock up in a BMW and announce he is snapping up the entire supply of grub Except it's not a like foodbank; it's literally a market and this is the cost of markets and the reason many socialists oppose them.

> State-aid rules were suspended during covid-19, as national governments bailed out everything from airlines to pizzerias. This is anything but a free market, and the consequences thereof. Actually a very good analogy for NGEU program.

As if industrial capitalists play fair. "Free markets" live in textbooks.

Re: The single market is looking wobbly

#29

Post by moomin »

KerrAvon wrote: post #20
systemvoltage wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This kind of ad-hominem happens on every Economist thread here. First order of business is to take a jab at the Economist. That just means factual things are being reported and people don't want to confront reality.

The Economist lost a lot of credibility with some of us around the turn of the century, when it fatally misunderstood US politics and wrote columns addressing people like Karl Rove and asking them to follow their better nature. (Karl Rove does not have a better nature.)

Not helped by one of their senior editors taking a sabbatical to become a full time crank.

Re: The single market is looking wobbly

#30

Post by yrgulation »

inglor_cz wrote: post #16
yrgulation wrote: post #4

“In case anyone felt their nose insufficiently rubbed in German success” All good things come to an end. Also it feels like if the weather will suck tomorrow it will be blamed on germany. Where are the other countries in all this? Taking a nap?

Germany was a huge winner from introduction of the Euro. Some other countries, especially the Latin bloc, cannot cope with the common currency. (Ironically, it was the German economists who used to be very skeptical against the common currency and were loud about it.) At the end of the day, the single market will only be popular if growth and prosperity are shared across the continent. If the economic periphery plagu…

Agreed. If change doesnt happen in everyone’s interest it will result in a fatal split. The biggest loser will be germany tho. Without access to the markets that prop up its economy it will suffer an economic contraction it’s never seen in modern times.
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