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Day ahead electricity prices for EU

euenergy.live

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Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#21

Post by consp »

bitL wrote: post #4

I've read somewhere that Czechs (day ahead price of 463EUR/MWh) produce electricity at 0.1EUR/MWh, then sell it to an exchange in Germany and buy it back for the "market" price. Somebody over there is getting extremely rich for no reason and I am wondering why nobody is doing anything about it...

Purely speculative but sounds more like greenwashing to me: sell grey energy on market at loss, buy back mixed or even green due to some loophole, collect subsidies which cover the difference or even more.

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#22

Post by bitL »

sokoloff wrote: post #12
bitL wrote: post #4

I've read somewhere that Czechs (day ahead price of 463EUR/MWh) produce electricity at 0.1EUR/MWh, then sell it to an exchange in Germany and buy it back for the "market" price. Somebody over there is getting extremely rich for no reason and I am wondering why nobody is doing anything about it...

If you could make electricity for 0.1€/MWh, you’re going to get quite rich anyway. (That cannot be the right cost.)

IIRC they are mostly using nuclear power plants, i.e. from cheap Russian fuel rods stockpiles.

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#23

Post by sprak »

Sweden has four zones and according to [1] tomorrow's price will be from north to south:

Zone 1: 14,25 cents/kWh

Zone 2: 14,25 cents/kWh

Zone 3: 108,64 cents/kWh

Zone 4: 201,63 cents/kWh

1 Swedish krona is 0,094 USD. So between 1,3 and 20 American cents per kWh.

Most people live in Zone 3 followed by Zone 4. Facebook's datacenter is in Zone 1.

[1]: https://elen.nu

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#24

Post by gruez »

bitL wrote: post #4

I've read somewhere that Czechs (day ahead price of 463EUR/MWh) produce electricity at 0.1EUR/MWh, then sell it to an exchange in Germany and buy it back for the "market" price. Somebody over there is getting extremely rich for no reason and I am wondering why nobody is doing anything about it...

You must have omitted something in your example because it makes no sense.

>Czechs produce electricity at 0.1EUR/MWh

so far so good. Now you have -0.1EUR and 1MWh of power.

>then sell it to an exchange in Germany

suppose the market price is 400EUR. after selling it to an exchange you have 399.9EUR and 0 MWh of power

>and buy it back for the "market" price.

so you buy it back at the market price. Now you have -0.1EUR and 1MWh of power. That leaves you off... in the same position as step 1? What's the point in selling it to the exchange and buying it back?

Moreover, I don't see anything interesting happening here. You can replace "electricity" with "oil" and you basically describe how petro states work (ie. pump oil out of the ground, sell it on the global market for far more than it costs for you to pump it out of the ground).

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#25

Post by dkjaudyeqooe »

Cantinflas wrote: post #9

AFAIK Spain prices are not "real" in the sense that gas prices have been "capped" and electricity users have to pay generation companies that use gas a variable fee to compensate that cap. Real end-user price is likely double

In Croatian electricity prices have only gone up 15% this year because of government intervention. The actual costs are something like 10x.

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#26

Post by mechagodzilla »

bitL wrote: post #4

I've read somewhere that Czechs (day ahead price of 463EUR/MWh) produce electricity at 0.1EUR/MWh, then sell it to an exchange in Germany and buy it back for the "market" price. Somebody over there is getting extremely rich for no reason and I am wondering why nobody is doing anything about it...

That would almost certainly be the price per kilowatt-hour, not megawatt-hour, which would make a MWh ~100EUR. Anybody that is getting rich on the energy markets right now is either because they're better at betting on future energy prices than their rivals, or they have the ability to produce electricity when demand for it is extraordinarily high (both of which would qualify as 'a reason').

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#27

Post by sokoloff »

bitL wrote: post #22
sokoloff wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you could make electricity for 0.1€/MWh, you’re going to get quite rich anyway. (That cannot be the right cost.)

IIRC they are mostly using nuclear power plants, i.e. from cheap Russian fuel rods stockpiles.

The estimate of western nuclear generation is around 330x the cited figure.

https://www.nei.org/news/2018/cost-of-nuclear-generation-rea...

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#28

Post by the_mitsuhiko »

capableweb wrote: post #7
bitL wrote: post #4

I've read somewhere that Czechs (day ahead price of 463EUR/MWh) produce electricity at 0.1EUR/MWh, then sell it to an exchange in Germany and buy it back for the "market" price. Somebody over there is getting extremely rich for no reason and I am wondering why nobody is doing anything about it...

> why nobody is doing anything about it > I've read somewhere Before wondering why someone, somewhere is not doing something, confirm that the thing is actually happening in the first place.

I have no clue about Czechia but that’s basically happening in Austria. Austria mainly produces energy from renewables which did not go up in price buy since the price on the exchanges is determined by the most expensive source we still pay exorbitant prices. Producers are making all the money right now.

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#29

Post by MomoXenosaga »

neverrroot wrote: post #20

Green without a proper plan? Germany/Europe will be the green poster children on how not to do it. Guess who will damage the environment more in the end.

No matter what magic plan anyone comes up with it would take years to implement. Nuclear, more insulation, hydrogen, new gas fields. It's almost winter already.
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