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Tech Compensation in Europe

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Re: Tech Compensation in Europe

#21

Post by dijit »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #18
dijit wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tax returns are public in Sweden too. I would guess it's the same in Denmark (even if they're not quite as socialist); Perhaps Finland. But the majority of tech in Europe is: Dublin, Berlin and Amsterdam. AFAIK none of those have host countries which publicly disclose tax information;

>But the majority of tech in Europe is: Dublin, Berlin and Amsterdam. And Zurich and London (non-EU).

Ah yes, I totally forgot the non-EU ones.

Zurich IME is more in line with Californian salaries though.

Re: Tech Compensation in Europe

#22

Post by em500 »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #6
WrtCdEvrydy wrote: post #2

The worst bit about this is that in Europe, employers don't have to pay for insurance versus the US side yet we still find ways to dick over our European hires by having them come in very low. I've worked at places making 150k USD where the most knowledgeable people I worked with were making 90k GBP in Europe. We lost a lot of people during the great exodus of inflation at the beginning of the "Ukraine training exerc…

>in Europe, employers don't have to pay for insurance They do in some cases. In France and Austria (I think Germany and others too), the gross salary you negociate to get is actually even higher for the employer as there is a tax the employer must pay on top of that to cover his side of the social contributions. I wish this would be more transparent. What you said applies to places like Denmark, Switzerland, where th…

I don't know about Denmark or Switzerland, but in the Netherlands employers certainly have to pay premiums for social (mainly unemployment and disability) insurance.

Re: Tech Compensation in Europe

#23

Post by ptr »

dijit wrote: post #17
bandris wrote: post #5

Tax returns should be public. Like in Norway. That would sort out all kinds of "payment gap" issues as well.

Tax returns are public in Sweden too. I would guess it's the same in Denmark (even if they're not quite as socialist); Perhaps Finland. But the majority of tech in Europe is: Dublin, Berlin and Amsterdam. AFAIK none of those have host countries which publicly disclose tax information;

Sweden and Denmark don’t differ in how much “socialist” they are. Also, they’re not socialist countries.

Re: Tech Compensation in Europe

#24

Post by ChuckNorris89 »

em500 wrote: post #22
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>in Europe, employers don't have to pay for insurance They do in some cases. In France and Austria (I think Germany and others too), the gross salary you negociate to get is actually even higher for the employer as there is a tax the employer must pay on top of that to cover his side of the social contributions. I wish this would be more transparent. What you said applies to places like Denmark, Switzerland, where th…

I don't know about Denmark or Switzerland, but in the Netherlands employers certainly have to pay premiums for social (mainly unemployment and disability) insurance.

Ah sorry then. I thought otherwise.

Re: Tech Compensation in Europe

#25

Post by ChuckNorris89 »

dijit wrote: post #21
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>But the majority of tech in Europe is: Dublin, Berlin and Amsterdam. And Zurich and London (non-EU).

Ah yes, I totally forgot the non-EU ones. Zurich IME is more in line with Californian salaries though.

While being more expensive than California.

Re: Tech Compensation in Europe

#27

Post by Hamuko »

bandris wrote: post #5

Tax returns should be public. Like in Norway. That would sort out all kinds of "payment gap" issues as well.

Most people don't go around perusing other people's tax returns even if they are public though. I'm not sure if most people even realise that they can just go and ask the tax authorities on what their boss makes.

Re: Tech Compensation in Europe

#28

Post by bryanrasmussen »

bibaheu wrote: post #16
schnitzelstoat wrote: post #12

It'll be interesting when they add Southern Europe. I've seen adverts for experienced developers that pay €35k. And life isn't that much cheaper in the cities here.

I keep getting calls from recruiters offering 30k€ in North Spain, but they are hurting, as nowadays everybody is getting better deals thanks to remote work.

so I guess this is annual, not monthly? Or is there some other division of salary that I haven't thought of?

Re: Tech Compensation in Europe

#29

Post by dijit »

ptr wrote: post #23
dijit wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tax returns are public in Sweden too. I would guess it's the same in Denmark (even if they're not quite as socialist); Perhaps Finland. But the majority of tech in Europe is: Dublin, Berlin and Amsterdam. AFAIK none of those have host countries which publicly disclose tax information;

Sweden and Denmark don’t differ in how much “socialist” they are. Also, they’re not socialist countries.

Sweden & Denmark favour high taxes and social responsibility; I'm sure you are aware but in socialist countries, healthcare, education and economic support are all provided free to every citizen, regardless of how much they earn.

Sweden & Denmark absolutely live that vision.

People get confused because they've conflated socialism and communism, where communism is a means of controlling and distributing the means of production across the people; an economic model that differs from socialism which puts the needs of the people in control of the state; but allows innovation outside of that.

Some people also get confused because they believe that anything involving a private market means Capitalism; that's not true, capitalism is a specific system where, by definition, the wealth has similar rights to the labour in how it gets paid. Some people think this is why capitalism is innovative, because it incentivises "old money" capital to invest, but it favours rewarding people who already have money, which is at odds with the Swedish model.

I think you're right that Denmark is not materially less socialist, in fact you could argue that Sweden is the less socialist one as they've been selling off their healthcare systems to private healthcare for a while now.. Which has resulted in a pretty bad healthcare system honestly.

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