Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Jeffrey Snower was originally demoted over PowerShell

twitter.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 153 posts

Re: Jeffrey Snower was originally demoted over PowerShell

#21

Post by lloydatkinson »

mjburgess wrote: post #18

I've often wondered why powershell hasnt taken off on linux/mac. I'd guess MS would have a good case for investing there (given, eg., linux usage on azure). Particularly in the recent history of "every day, another shell" on linux/mac. Powershell seems to solve the problem being resolved in rust,go,scala,... over-and-over. Why not just use that?

Powershell runs on Linux and macos too because of .NET Core/5+. The real reason is likely the same sort of people that are still typing Micro$oft in and keep spreading FUD that .NET isn't OS.

Re: Jeffrey Snower was originally demoted over PowerShell

#23

Post by cobbal »

mjburgess wrote: post #18

I've often wondered why powershell hasnt taken off on linux/mac. I'd guess MS would have a good case for investing there (given, eg., linux usage on azure). Particularly in the recent history of "every day, another shell" on linux/mac. Powershell seems to solve the problem being resolved in rust,go,scala,... over-and-over. Why not just use that?

As a mac user, I was going to provide a flippant answer, but I decided to look into it instead. Personally, I use zsh or a custom built shell scripting library inside swift. Always like to see improvements to shells though. Googled for it and got a dozen guides on how to install it in mac, but none that actually explained how to use it. (One video result looked like it might have some info, but to me that doesn't count as documentation). All the documentation on powershell is targeted at windows devs, and it's just a very different culture.

Flippant answer: the CapitalizationConvention-ShouldScare-EveryoneAway

Re: Jeffrey Snower was originally demoted over PowerShell

#24

Post by code_runner »

cobbal wrote: post #23
mjburgess wrote: post #18

I've often wondered why powershell hasnt taken off on linux/mac. I'd guess MS would have a good case for investing there (given, eg., linux usage on azure). Particularly in the recent history of "every day, another shell" on linux/mac. Powershell seems to solve the problem being resolved in rust,go,scala,... over-and-over. Why not just use that?

As a mac user, I was going to provide a flippant answer, but I decided to look into it instead. Personally, I use zsh or a custom built shell scripting library inside swift. Always like to see improvements to shells though. Googled for it and got a dozen guides on how to install it in mac, but none that actually explained how to use it. (One video result looked like it might have some info, but to me that doesn't cou…

Imo your flippant answer is bang on

Re: Jeffrey Snower was originally demoted over PowerShell

#25

Post by beagle3 »

tjoff wrote: post #6
omega3 wrote: post #5

I find this twitter thread frustrating. Q: What was the justification for the demotion? What became of the leaders that made that decision? A: It was stranger than you can possibly imagine I think the gist of the story is that he was assigned to work on X but worked on Y instead. Notwithstanding how great Y idea turned out to be it seems he was demoted for insubordination?

Twitter threads are frustrating no matter the content, after two replies I get a banner that blocks me from reading until I register. Not gonna happen.

Nitter is your friend if you care (while it lasts). Nitter.net or nitter.eu usually work for me.

Re: Jeffrey Snower was originally demoted over PowerShell

#26

Post by EnKopVand »

omega3 wrote: post #5

I find this twitter thread frustrating. Q: What was the justification for the demotion? What became of the leaders that made that decision? A: It was stranger than you can possibly imagine I think the gist of the story is that he was assigned to work on X but worked on Y instead. Notwithstanding how great Y idea turned out to be it seems he was demoted for insubordination?

> it seems he was demoted for insubordination?

Probably, and what management blunder that would have been if Jeffrey had left Microsoft because of it.

Re: Jeffrey Snower was originally demoted over PowerShell

#27

Post by _Microft »

beagle3 wrote: post #25
tjoff wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Twitter threads are frustrating no matter the content, after two replies I get a banner that blocks me from reading until I register. Not gonna happen.

Nitter is your friend if you care (while it lasts). Nitter.net or nitter.eu usually work for me.

Using Nitter is as easy as replacing twitter.com with e.g. nitter.net or .eu:

https://nitter.net/jsnover/status/1523010444570419200

Re: Jeffrey Snower was originally demoted over PowerShell

#28

Post by lazypenguin »

einpoklum wrote: post #3

Question for the PowerShell afficionados: Do you consider PowerShell to be "something we can count on to exist on Windows systems, in the absence of Bourne-like shells" - or is it "a superior alternative to Bourne shells which only got traction on Windows because Bourne is too deeply embedded in the Unix world"?

Honestly I enjoy writing powershell more than bash scripts. Bash syntax is arcane and sometimes inconsistent where as powershell 7+ is fairly comfortable syntax.

However, powershell does often feel cludgy and I often have have to figure out how to do more complex things. Not a perfect solution but it integrates with Windows nicely.

Re: Jeffrey Snower was originally demoted over PowerShell

#29

Post by yebyen »

lloydatkinson wrote: post #21
mjburgess wrote: post #18

I've often wondered why powershell hasnt taken off on linux/mac. I'd guess MS would have a good case for investing there (given, eg., linux usage on azure). Particularly in the recent history of "every day, another shell" on linux/mac. Powershell seems to solve the problem being resolved in rust,go,scala,... over-and-over. Why not just use that?

Powershell runs on Linux and macos too because of .NET Core/5+. The real reason is likely the same sort of people that are still typing Micro$oft in and keep spreading FUD that .NET isn't OS.

I have never heard anyone "spreading FUD that .NET isn't OS" but I have heard plenty of times from Mac and Linux users, "why would you want to use PowerShell" and I am mining this thread for answers, because I honestly don't know for myself.

And it's objectively true that .NET/PowerShell is targeting Windows users, (which if you're Microsoft, why wouldn't you do that?) so, assuming that you don't care about interoperability with Windows users, don't use Windows yourself, don't have any customers asking for PowerShell support for whatever XYZ widget you build... what are the compelling reasons to run PS on Linux or Mac?

Setting up .NET is an investment, and learning to program it is an investment, people invest in the Go, Rust, Ruby, Python, TypeScript, JS ecosystems because they are generally useful, and that extends to Windows people, but if I'm building a product targeting Mac or Linux (servers), what is the incentive for me to make my customers install the .NET runtime at the proper version and fiddle with .exe files (or am I completely off base about how it works?)

Re: Jeffrey Snower was originally demoted over PowerShell

#30

Post by beagle3 »

lloydatkinson wrote: post #21
mjburgess wrote: post #18

I've often wondered why powershell hasnt taken off on linux/mac. I'd guess MS would have a good case for investing there (given, eg., linux usage on azure). Particularly in the recent history of "every day, another shell" on linux/mac. Powershell seems to solve the problem being resolved in rust,go,scala,... over-and-over. Why not just use that?

Powershell runs on Linux and macos too because of .NET Core/5+. The real reason is likely the same sort of people that are still typing Micro$oft in and keep spreading FUD that .NET isn't OS.

My answer is: I’ve been using sh/csh/tcsh/bash/zsh/fish for almost 30 years at this point. I’ve used powershell on windows, and it’s not bad, but it doesn’t give me anything useful on Linux I don’t already have with bash or zsh. And whenever a script needs more power, I reach for Python.

(Maybe I should xonsh instead? But the question for me isn’t “why not pwsh?” But rather “why pwsh?”)

Post reply on HN