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A simple explanation of how money moves around the banking system (2013)

gendal.me

21–30 of 68 posts

Re: A simple explanation of how money moves around the banking system (2013)

#21
Edit: Apologies for being slightly off topic here - this was meant more as a response to a comment elsewhere on money creation.

I've been keenly interested in the subject of banks, debt, and money creation ever since I picked up a book on the subject of debt around 2006. I really appreciated having a (very faulty but nonetheless useful) mental model to apply when trying to make sense of subsequent events. I sometimes like to think that I saw the GFC coming, but was probably just primed to see how precarious our debt based financial system had become.

With my local (NZ) housing market once again appearing to be on the brink of big changes (many are suggesting a crash), my interest has been piqued again. Looking about at what is out there that can help me make sense of what's going on I rediscovered a nice little interview (from our friends at RT no doubt) that I'd recommend to anyone trying to create their own mental model to help them understand the fascinating, frustrating, and confusing reality of banking.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EC0G7pY4wRE

One of the interviewees is Richard Werner - the man who introduced the concept of quantitative easing during the Japanese Financial crisis in the 90s.

Re: A simple explanation of how money moves around the banking system (2013)

#22
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Strange that private companies are allowed to create money from nothing don't you think?

It's strange if you have a particular conception of money. If you think of money as a social technology used to improve aggregate well being, then it's just a property that empirically makes sense. Private banking, with effective regulation, has proven to be a fairly effective way to stabilize the business cycle and unblock growth

Sure, it helps to improve the aggregate well being of those who participate in the fake economy at the expense of those who participate in the real economy... Great for crooks!

Re: A simple explanation of how money moves around the banking system (2013)

#23
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simple, but completely wrong. The bank never loans your money. When it wants to originate a loan it creates new deposits from nothing.

Except that the people who are loaned money withdraw it pretty quickly, and then the bank does need cash from deposits (or from inter-bank lending, but the net amount of that is zero).

> or from inter-bank lending, but the net amount of that is zero

Banks in a crunch don’t look for deposits. They approach the Fed’s discount window [1].

Capital requirements aim to ensure banks have enough high-quality collateral to borrow sufficient reserves in most catastrophes. (When the situation threatens to exceed that threshold, we call it a systemic event.)

[1] https://www.federalreserve.gov/regreform/discount-window.htm

Re: A simple explanation of how money moves around the banking system (2013)

#24
post #3

The simplest explanation: - You invest in the bank - The bank loans your money to someone else at high interest rate - The bank gets paid, keeps most of the profit and uses a small part of it for your investment.

Simple, but completely wrong. The bank never loans your money. When it wants to originate a loan it creates new deposits from nothing.

Correspondent banking just seems messed up at the incentive layer... Seems like there is an incentive for banks to just credit free money into each other's accounts... Surely they can create lots of smaller (low profile) banks with accounts all over the place then use this mechanism to print free money for themselves to expand the money supply ad-infinitum. The attack surface is massive. With the same money being loaned and re-loaned across thousands of different banks, how could anyone possibly detect fraudulent currency creation (and distinguish it from genuine deposits)? It just takes one bank to act unethically in a chain of several thousands in order to subvert the entire system.

Even without unethical behavior, it seems like a small chance of human error, when applied across thousands of banks, would cause accidental printed money to leak into the system. For example, there have been many news reports of banks accidentally crediting people with 100x the money which they were supposed to receive; what about all the times when such error occurred but was not detected and did not make the news? That money still found its way into the economy and still contributed to inflation.

The problem can be simply summarized as too many single points of failure.

Re: A simple explanation of how money moves around the banking system (2013)

#25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's strange if you have a particular conception of money. If you think of money as a social technology used to improve aggregate well being, then it's just a property that empirically makes sense. Private banking, with effective regulation, has proven to be a fairly effective way to stabilize the business cycle and unblock growth

Sure, it helps to improve the aggregate well being of those who participate in the fake economy at the expense of those who participate in the real economy... Great for crooks!

> it helps to improve the aggregate well being of those who participate in the fake economy at the expense of those who participate in the real economy

This is financial Luddism. Just because something is unfamiliar doesn’t mean it’s bad.

Private money creation is necessary for a growing, dynamic economic condition. (The problem is simpler in a static or simply cyclic economy.) Growth is heterogenous. To preserve price and bank stability, you want money created where it’s needed and not in excess where it’s not. In times past, this was largely geographic: banks in the West created money faster than banks in the agrarian South. Today, the divisions are more complex: a bank serving tech companies probably creates more deposits than one serving aging manufacturers.

Centralising this function in a state apparatus has been proposed. But the central bank would have to run and then implement an economic model. Decide where and for whom to create money. This is central planning. It has a poor track record. (This is also the argument against bank concentration [1].)

[1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/DDOI01USA156NWDB

Re: A simple explanation of how money moves around the banking system (2013)

#26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that the people who are loaned money withdraw it pretty quickly, and then the bank does need cash from deposits (or from inter-bank lending, but the net amount of that is zero).

> or from inter-bank lending, but the net amount of that is zero Banks in a crunch don’t look for deposits. They approach the Fed’s discount window [1]. Capital requirements aim to ensure banks have enough high-quality collateral to borrow sufficient reserves in most catastrophes. (When the situation threatens to exceed that threshold, we call it a systemic event.) [1] https://www.federalreserve.gov/regreform/discoun…

Banks cover their funding needs through the interbank market that provides the overnight loans required to balance their books at the end of the day. Banks will raise deposit rates to attract deposits if they constantly find that they need to go to the interbank market to balance their books because it is cheaper.

The discount window is used when the bank is unable to access the interbank market which is usually an indicator the bank is expected to fail. The discount window provides liquidity for high quality assets at high costs (which is why it is called the discount window).

If the bank runs out of high quality assets and can’t raise capital it becomes insolvent (bankrupt) and the FDIC takes over the bank and winds it down.

Re: A simple explanation of how money moves around the banking system (2013)

#27
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> or from inter-bank lending, but the net amount of that is zero Banks in a crunch don’t look for deposits. They approach the Fed’s discount window [1]. Capital requirements aim to ensure banks have enough high-quality collateral to borrow sufficient reserves in most catastrophes. (When the situation threatens to exceed that threshold, we call it a systemic event.) [1] https://www.federalreserve.gov/regreform/discoun…

Banks cover their funding needs through the interbank market that provides the overnight loans required to balance their books at the end of the day. Banks will raise deposit rates to attract deposits if they constantly find that they need to go to the interbank market to balance their books because it is cheaper. The discount window is used when the bank is unable to access the interbank market which is usually an i…

> will raise deposit rates to attract deposits if they constantly find that they need to go to the interbank market to balance their books because it is cheaper

This is true for the largest banks. For many smaller banks, interbank lending is cheaper than deposits. Particularly if those deposits must come from new customers.

Your model is roughly correct over long, strategic time periods. But in tactical timeframes, deposits are assumed fixed or lightly. (In fact, the post-97 role of money centre banks has been to attract deposits to then lend to smaller banks.)

Re: A simple explanation of how money moves around the banking system (2013)

#28
post #8
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This used to be true, but hasn't mattered for a long time. The reserve requirement is zero for most (all?) US banks. https://www.federalreserve.gov/monetarypolicy/reservereq.htm

Strange that private companies are allowed to create money from nothing don't you think?

It’s the defining characteristic of a banking license. Like any license it permits activity that would otherwise be illegal. In this case, creating new dollars.

Re: A simple explanation of how money moves around the banking system (2013)

#29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, it helps to improve the aggregate well being of those who participate in the fake economy at the expense of those who participate in the real economy... Great for crooks!

> it helps to improve the aggregate well being of those who participate in the fake economy at the expense of those who participate in the real economy This is financial Luddism. Just because something is unfamiliar doesn’t mean it’s bad. Private money creation is necessary for a growing, dynamic economic condition. (The problem is simpler in a static or simply cyclic economy.) Growth is heterogenous. To preserve pri…

The way the banking system works now, it mostly creates money where it's not needed. That's why there is such high inequality which keeps growing. New capital is just deployed to chase old capital. It creates anti-competitive moats which prevent money from going where it's really needed and where it could be used most efficiently. It makes bureaucracy viable and economic efficiency non-viable.

The vast majority of people who benefit from bank loans are not value creators, they are rent-seekers. Value creation necessarily requires taking calculated risks and banks these days aren't willing to take any risk.... They need full collateral. It's all about existing collateral. In the short term, the safest investment you can make is to build a moat around your existing investment... But if everyone in the economy is busy building moats (because that's the only activity which is sufficiency safe for banks to fund), there will be nobody remaining to do useful stuff which moves the economy forward.

Re: A simple explanation of how money moves around the banking system (2013)

#30
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simple, but completely wrong. The bank never loans your money. When it wants to originate a loan it creates new deposits from nothing.

Correspondent banking just seems messed up at the incentive layer... Seems like there is an incentive for banks to just credit free money into each other's accounts... Surely they can create lots of smaller (low profile) banks with accounts all over the place then use this mechanism to print free money for themselves to expand the money supply ad-infinitum. The attack surface is massive. With the same money being loa…

A homeowner can take $100,000 from a home equity line of credit and drop it into his savings account and create $100,000 in new dollars with a button click. The bank didn’t need to “get” deposits to make this happen as the deposits are created when the homeowner took out the loan. The new dollars and the liability are just entries in the banks balance book but the dollars can be spent like any other dollar at that point.

If the next day the homeowner moved all the money back and paid off the equity the dollars are destroyed. This is how a bank works.

The size of a banks balance sheet and the number of dollars it can create is constrained by the amount of shareholder equity (by regulation). Regulators typically require a 10 to 1 ratio of loans to capital which has potential for fraud.

Just imagine if you had 10 banks levered 10 to 1 and you took all the deposits and put them on black at the local casino. Half of your bets would yield a 10x return on capital and the others you’d lose all your capital (and all your depositors money) but on average you’d make 5x.

Because of the risk banks are highly regulated and regulators require that named individuals that can be held personally and criminally liable for fraud and auditors who also can be held personally and criminally liable as well.

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