Funniest thing is that the companies with the most extreme leetcode interviews, Facebook, roblox, etc also fell the hardest in the most recent sell off. There’s even a quote by kieth rabois, one one the top VCs, that FB hired and built their culture around optimization, which has failed. They can’t innovate because innovative type people weren’t let into the company.
Are developers really counted on for innovation anyway? We seem like implementation units. Someone else makes decisions and creates tickets for devs to work on.
Misidentifying talent
21–30 of 167 posts
Re: Misidentifying talent
#22It’s striking that so many stories about the triumph of metrics over intuition involve games. I’m convinced that you should put statisticians in charge if your goal is to win a game. I’m not convinced that related behaviors, like constructing a game adjacent to the problem you’re actually trying to solve and treating game performance as a proxy (like LeetCode interviews! Or KPIs!) are helpful. It’s also interesting t…
The devil is as always in the details. At least as far as KPIs go, they can be very useful if they are chosen appropriately and if the senior team members have all bought in to the concept. Example:
I used to work in military search and rescue, and the pilots get tasked by a complex bureaucracy indirectly descended from NORAD, and they have a requirement in most areas to be airborne within 30 minutes when called. Thus, our maintenance flight had as its first and foremost KPI chosen "percentage of the time where maintenance can't get an aircraft ready to be flying missions in less than 30 minutes".
That's a fantastic KPI because the maintainers that worked for us were all on board. Getting that KPI as close to 0 as possible (and we did hit zero every few months) was a goal that everyone had bought into, because of course if you can't put an aircraft in the sky then it potentially means people are dying unnecessarily.
Now, any AME or military aircraft tech can tell you the paperwork requirements for aircraft maintenance are very strict and at times quite onerous, but they're required by federal law. So the same maintenance organization also had, broadly, "paperwork error rates" as a tertiary KPI, because of course the maintenance paperwork gets audited by an AS9100 or similar quality assurance shop, usually in-house.
That one is a shitty KPI because the wrench turners who work on complex jobs are more likely to make errors in the paperwork, so there's a perverse incentive wherein your best maintainers make about the same number of mistakes as your journeymen right out of school, simply because it's easier to fill out the paperwork properly for topping up an oil reservoir compared to changing a propeller or a weight-and-balance.
All that to say KPIs themselves are not the problem. Shitty leaders who choose KPIs improperly are the problem.
Re: Misidentifying talent
#23Funny enough, the shorter programmers were generally much more competent from having to actually earn their place. If you have to pick a doctor or lawyer on looks alone, I recommend picking the shorter guy (or the woman!)
Re: Misidentifying talent
#24Funniest thing is that the companies with the most extreme leetcode interviews, Facebook, roblox, etc also fell the hardest in the most recent sell off. There’s even a quote by kieth rabois, one one the top VCs, that FB hired and built their culture around optimization, which has failed. They can’t innovate because innovative type people weren’t let into the company.
Are developers really counted on for innovation anyway? We seem like implementation units. Someone else makes decisions and creates tickets for devs to work on.
> In "traditional" companies, developers get work items assigned to them - most often JIRA tickets. These tickets are vetted by the product - or project - manager, and they have most key details to do the work. And they're expected to do just that. There's little need for questions unless it's about clarifying a detail in the ticket.
> Join a "SV-like" company, and you'll see little of this. There are projects, and there are program managers and engineering managers. But for the most part, engineers are expected (and encouraged!) to figure out the "how" of the work, including making larger decisions. In some places, each project would have an engineer leading it, who facilitates breaking up the work. At other places, engineering managers or senior engineers could do this work. Regardless of how it's done, all engineers are incentivized to look at the big picture, to unblock themselves, and to solve any problem they see.
> Engineers taking initiative is something "SV-like" companies celebrate. It's common to see services and features built that engineers suggested or have teams spend dedicated time paying off tech debt that people on the team advocated for. And it is uncommon for managers to tell engineers what exactly to do, to break down their work into small chunks or to micromanage them. People self manage.
> The expectation from developers at traditional companies is to complete assigned work. At SV-like companies, it's to solve problems that the business has. This is a huge difference. It impacts the day-to-day life of any engineer.
Re: Misidentifying talent
#25I strongly agree with this. Every programmer who became "upper management" also happened to be 6'1"+. Shocking. Funny enough, the shorter programmers were generally much more competent from having to actually earn their place. If you have to pick a doctor or lawyer on looks alone, I recommend picking the shorter guy (or the woman!)
Multiple people have told me I surprise them with how tall I am when we finally meet in person, mostly because I keep my camera at the top of my computer, which gives a slightly down-leaning angle, as if they were looking down at me.
This could be used to a real advantage by putting the camera under the monitor. It's also not quite a flattering look so I avoid it, but I wonder if this is to my detriment...
Re: Misidentifying talent
#26I strongly agree with this. Every programmer who became "upper management" also happened to be 6'1"+. Shocking. Funny enough, the shorter programmers were generally much more competent from having to actually earn their place. If you have to pick a doctor or lawyer on looks alone, I recommend picking the shorter guy (or the woman!)
Well, there is a consideration for management positions that says an appearance that evokes deference is a genuine qualification for the job.
And while it would be difficult to make that argument for doctors, it's not at all difficult for lawyers.
Re: Misidentifying talent
#27I strongly agree with this. Every programmer who became "upper management" also happened to be 6'1"+. Shocking. Funny enough, the shorter programmers were generally much more competent from having to actually earn their place. If you have to pick a doctor or lawyer on looks alone, I recommend picking the shorter guy (or the woman!)
As someone taller than 6'1", I will say this advantage is, well, shrinking with the advent of WFH culture. Multiple people have told me I surprise them with how tall I am when we finally meet in person, mostly because I keep my camera at the top of my computer, which gives a slightly down-leaning angle, as if they were looking down at me. This could be used to a real advantage by putting the camera under the monitor.…
Re: Misidentifying talent
#28Earlier quoted context omitted.
Are developers really counted on for innovation anyway? We seem like implementation units. Someone else makes decisions and creates tickets for devs to work on.
Sounds like you're working at a more traditional company then: https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/what-silicon-valley-gets-... > In "traditional" companies, developers get work items assigned to them - most often JIRA tickets. These tickets are vetted by the product - or project - manager, and they have most key details to do the work. And they're expected to do just that. There's little need for questions unless it'…
Isn't the traditional company approach having engineers in charge of engineering?
Re: Misidentifying talent
#29Earlier quoted context omitted.
As someone taller than 6'1", I will say this advantage is, well, shrinking with the advent of WFH culture. Multiple people have told me I surprise them with how tall I am when we finally meet in person, mostly because I keep my camera at the top of my computer, which gives a slightly down-leaning angle, as if they were looking down at me. This could be used to a real advantage by putting the camera under the monitor.…
Are you sure they're getting the idea that they can look down at you from the fact that your camera looks down on you from above your screen, as opposed to the fact that they themselves literally look down on you as you appear on their screen?
Re: Misidentifying talent
#30Earlier quoted context omitted.
My takeaway has been that the fastest growing (especially consumer-oriented) tech companies put up the highest bars to hiring, simply because they'll still get enough candidates to end up with enough people. IBM can't be as picky as Roblox.
Does that mean one would find themselves in an environment surrounded by bright innovative minds should they go for IBM?