More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’ • Hacker News Board

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#21

Post by SerLava » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 6:41 PM UTC

_xnmw wrote: post #7

The risk is now "priced in" to our consciousness. Back when it first started, covid was a big scary unknown risk to take for simply going outside and interacting with people. Now, it's a well-known risk, and people are willing to take that risk, along with other well-known risks for going outside, like the risk of getting into a car accident or slipping and falling.

Yes it's sort of like the alarming scourge of preventable automotive deaths, except that it's over 10 times worse. Also like slipping and falling, but about 20 times worse.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#22

Post by ashtonkem » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 6:42 PM UTC

dragontamer wrote: post #3

torstenvl wrote: post #2

I think it boils down to two questions: - What is the average level of risk to someone taking reasonable personal precautions? - What level of state-sponsored violence is justifiable to further reduce that risk? Governments and societies have been acting out-of-control and it needs to stop. If people don't want to take personal precautions, they should be at liberty to assume the additional risk.

> - What is the average level of risk to someone taking reasonable personal precautions? Depends on how full hospitals get. We all get into accidents. We fall and hit our heads, we might get a heart attack, a pregnancy might suddenly go bad and a C-section (or worse surgery) is needed. As COVID19 fills up hospitals around the country, the risk isn't from Omicron itself anymore, as much as it is from an overburdened h…

Also, chances are we’re going to exit this pandemic (whenever that happens) with a severely reduced medical system. We’re burning through medical personnel at an unsustainable rate, and we’re all going to suffer a diminished level of care until replacements can be retrained and hired.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#23

Post by throwawayboise » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 6:42 PM UTC

_xnmw wrote: post #7

The risk is now "priced in" to our consciousness. Back when it first started, covid was a big scary unknown risk to take for simply going outside and interacting with people. Now, it's a well-known risk, and people are willing to take that risk, along with other well-known risks for going outside, like the risk of getting into a car accident or slipping and falling.

Some people were in the "willing to take that risk" from the beginning, and were relentlessly demonized. Now it's OK though if everyone feels that way.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#24

Post by kerneloftruth » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 6:42 PM UTC

oauea wrote: post #6

torstenvl wrote: post #2

I think it boils down to two questions: - What is the average level of risk to someone taking reasonable personal precautions? - What level of state-sponsored violence is justifiable to further reduce that risk? Governments and societies have been acting out-of-control and it needs to stop. If people don't want to take personal precautions, they should be at liberty to assume the additional risk.

What violence?

Getting people fired from their jobs because they didn't want the vax is a form of state power. State power is ultimately backed up with police and prisons, where violence by them on you is legal.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#25

Post by peregren » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 6:42 PM UTC

EMM_386 wrote: post #14

I'm double vaxxed and boosted and just spent 4 days in the hospital with Covid. I actually entered the hospital without Covid and got it while I was in there. They had the entire place divided into separate wings and I had to be transferred between them. 103 degree fever, pulse 130, was pretty awful but came out of it fine. I, too, am done with all of it. Let the chips fall where they may now.

The vaccine may have kept you out of ICU. It doesn't seem logical to change to a "let the chips fall where they may" based on this experience.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#26

Post by drewg123 » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 6:43 PM UTC

I think a lot of this depends on the typical severity of Omicron (and future variants).

I'm vaccinated and boosted. I wear a mask in public. I don't go out much. I do travel fairly regularly (fly maybe 1-2x per month). I finally got Covid last week, likely on a flight. I had ~3 days of mild cold-like symptoms (sore throat, runny nose, congestion, very low grade fever that approached 101F). It was far less severe than any flu I've ever had. I extended my trip by a week to meet how I read the CDC guidelines (which are clear as mud for mildy symptomatic cases).

If the severity for everyone was that mild, then I'd say we're done. However, I worry about the unvaccinated and the unboosted. I wish there was better data on the severity of Omicron for different categories of people.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#27

Post by samspenc » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 6:43 PM UTC

denimnerd42 wrote: post #12

i think i'm done with current level vaccines. I've had 3 mrna. The second and third each took me out for 2 days. I don't see any reason for more unless a better one comes out. I do think 3 are important though.

Yeah, after contracting COVID in January 2021, and now 3 shots (including a booster), I'm just tired of the whole thing. If I'm not immune "enough" after all that, so be it.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#28

Post by dragontamer » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 6:43 PM UTC

aantix wrote: post #18

dragontamer wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> - What is the average level of risk to someone taking reasonable personal precautions? Depends on how full hospitals get. We all get into accidents. We fall and hit our heads, we might get a heart attack, a pregnancy might suddenly go bad and a C-section (or worse surgery) is needed. As COVID19 fills up hospitals around the country, the risk isn't from Omicron itself anymore, as much as it is from an overburdened h…

Do the hospitals have any obligations in this in terms of scalability and sustainability of their workforce? I understand that adding a doctor or nurse isn't immediate. Just as I understand that if a production system I oversee crashes under load, it may not have been foreseeable. But if the system is still crashing under load in five years? Ten years? At what point is it my fault? The U.S. healthcare spending in 202…

> But if the system is still crashing under load in five years? Ten years? At what point is it my fault?

The Maryland hospital system can support a bit over 10,000 hospitalizations. Over 3000 of those hospitalizations are COVID19 right now, and our cases continue to grow exponentially.

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Our hospital systems don't _normally_ get hit with 3000+ cases of a singular disease. Compared to other parts of the country, we have more hospital space, nurses and more, and we're still feeling stressed from all of this.

You _cant_ have enough hospital space during a pandemic. You just can't. The disease grows too fast, you get hit with way more cases than you've ever seen in the past 10, 20, 30, 50, 100 years. It doesn't make sense to design a system with 100-years worth of slack. It makes more sense to ask the public to do actions to cut back on hospitalizations during these rare 1-in-a-hundred-year situations.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#29

Post by Spartan-S63 » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 6:43 PM UTC

I think the message of "vaxxed and done" is the right way for us to be moving, but I think it's incomplete.

To get vaxxed insulates you from the risk of severe disease. It reduces the risk to the point that going out and living life is an acceptable risk, just like any other. However, it doesn't protect you from infecting others. To that end, I think that indoor mask mandates continue to be justifiable and should continue until we either evolve a COVID-19 variant weak enough that moderate disease isn't disruptive, or it fades away.

In order for us to continue to have freedom, it requires collective sacrifice. We have seen a large swath of the US population unwilling to make relatively simple sacrifices to ensure that we have freedom of mobility. This is disappointing to see.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#30

Post by VeninVidiaVicii » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 6:44 PM UTC

wing-_-nuts wrote: post #17

I'm fully vax'd and boosted. I'll probably continue to get boosted in the future. All that said? I feel like the government did a really bad job communicating who needs the booster and when. First, they gave vague recommendations to immunocompromised folks. They said everyone else probably didn't need it. Then they said well, ok for older folks. Then this new omni variant comes out and they're badgering everyone to g…

This is effectively a disconnect between science and public policy. Science teaches us to keep our minds open to new data, so we can make new conclusions as we go. People just seem to get pissed when public policy changes in light of new data, lending to the narrative that scientists don't know what they're talking about.