Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

How do you fix a stroad?

strongtowns.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 411 posts

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#21

Post by andbberger »

jimmaswell wrote: post #13
andbberger wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's not people are anti-car as much as they are pro-human. the majority of people (in the states) would not be car people if they had alternatives. stroads are hostile to anyone not in a car. making pedestrians hit a beg button to cross street is just reinforcing that they are trespassing on land that is not for them.

They have right of way regardless but the flashing sign increases safety. Are turn signals a "beg button"?

I dare you to cross a stroad without waiting for the pedestrian phase.

Turn signals are not beg buttons.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#22

Post by joe_the_user »

Overall, it seems simpler to say that malls, not stroads are the problem.

Malls will never be pedestrian friendly. Mall will never be aesthetically pleasant. Roads going by malls are usually stroads and might be made somewhat better. But that's such a trivial question compared to the pox that is mall urban organization that I really don't care.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#23

Post by jimmaswell »

derefr wrote: post #17
jimmaswell wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use stroads all the time and I can't agree. They don't bother me at all. Easy to navigate and not too slow or fast.

I imagine you'd change your tune if you had to choose between driving on roads vs. stroads professionally , as a truck driver, cab driver, etc. Roads — separated thoroughfares exclusively for cars, engineered to remove anything that would require stopping — minimize travel time, gas costs, and accidents. Stroads do none of those things. There's a reason that every Uber driver who has the opportunity will take you ont…

Truckers can't be big fans of narrower streets either. It seems to me more like a stroad just takes a street and makes it more convenient to through traffic with a bit of compromise to ease of crossing but not even particularly much detriment to walking on a single side.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#24

Post by jhgb »

jimmaswell wrote: post #3

I find the premise questionable that stroads are bad. Give a stroad good sidewalks, crosswalks with signs that light up when you hit a button, and a bike path and everybody is well-served. That or just let car people (majority) have these areas that are good for cars and let the anti car people have their crowded little streets with no parking elsewhere.

> and a bike path

Why do you want to kill so many cyclists?

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#25

Post by Rendello »

xvedejas wrote: post #4
jimmaswell wrote: post #3

I find the premise questionable that stroads are bad. Give a stroad good sidewalks, crosswalks with signs that light up when you hit a button, and a bike path and everybody is well-served. That or just let car people (majority) have these areas that are good for cars and let the anti car people have their crowded little streets with no parking elsewhere.

Pedestrians are the majority where I live; and even car drivers end up as pedestrians some of the time.

In my ideal city the majority of people would consider themselves pedestrians, cyclists, and (optionally) drivers, depending on the needs and conditions of the given day.

Edit: And public transit-takers, of course!

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#26

Post by ben-schaaf »

josephcsible wrote: post #15
calt wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That or just let car people (majority) have these areas that are good for cars and The idea is that a well planned city/suburb will turn car people into people that also enjoy safely not using a car some of the time. > let the anti car people have their crowded little streets with no parking elsewhere. Bleh. Such an us vs them mentality. I'm suspicious of cars because I have literally gotten hit by them while cycli…

> Bleh. Such an us vs them mentality. Doesn't the "us vs. them" mentality come from the fact that most of Strong Towns' ideas will make life worse for everyone who needs to drive, without giving most of them an alternative to driving?

The whole point is to provide better alternatives to driving such that most people don't need to drive. Having better alternatives to driving also makes driving better as you get less congestion, licensing standards can be raised, there's more money for road maintenance, well designed roads are simply better to drive on, etc.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#27

Post by calt »

Rendello wrote: post #18
josephcsible wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Bleh. Such an us vs them mentality. Doesn't the "us vs. them" mentality come from the fact that most of Strong Towns' ideas will make life worse for everyone who needs to drive, without giving most of them an alternative to driving?

> Strong Towns' ideas will make life worse for anyone who drives into the city, with basically no advantages for them, and without creating a viable alternative to driving for most of them? That's not necessarily a given: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8RRE2rDw4k

TLDW: A city that is less reliant on cars actually reduces congestion and makes it more pleasant to drive in a city.

Fewer cars on the road means less competition.

Bike lanes have more capacity to move people.

Well designed intersections and bike lanes mean that you aren't competing against cyclists and pedestrians for road space you're coexisting along just fine.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#28

Post by joe_the_user »

lelandbatey wrote: post #2

I love that this highlights an oft-missed truth about Urbanism and shifting our urban landscape: this is going to take a long time. It's going to take many decades, and it's going to require waiting for individual human beings to literally die before we get to start making the changes we want to make. I mean, unless we can get someone really excited about this into federal office in which case it _might_ be possible…

this is going to take a long time.'

The present world changes fast, when it changes. When someones says "this will take decades", I usually interpret that as "this isn't happening, there's nothing making it happen, only people talking".

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#29

Post by [deleted] »

jimmaswell wrote: post #12
derefr wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> areas that are good for cars You're talking about a road. Stroads are not good for cars. Because stroads have crosswalks, and people's driveways opening directly onto them, and many other things, traffic flow and "attentional efficiency" are both far worse than what you'd get from a real separated road with onramps/offramps. Roads are great. Streets are great. Good city planning involves plenty of both. Just like y…

I use stroads all the time and I can't agree. They don't bother me at all. Easy to navigate and not too slow or fast.

[deleted]

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#30

Post by davidrhunt »

Rendello wrote: post #18
josephcsible wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Bleh. Such an us vs them mentality. Doesn't the "us vs. them" mentality come from the fact that most of Strong Towns' ideas will make life worse for everyone who needs to drive, without giving most of them an alternative to driving?

> Strong Towns' ideas will make life worse for anyone who drives into the city, with basically no advantages for them, and without creating a viable alternative to driving for most of them? That's not necessarily a given: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8RRE2rDw4k

I was just tracking down this exact link. Thanks for sharing.
Post reply on HN