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A $5B hoard of aluminum

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21–30 of 91 posts

Re: A $5B hoard of aluminum

#21
post #19
post #17

The industry around the world is running out of aluminium. Aluminium mills are closing all around the globe, except for China. Why? No magnesium. And China don't let out its magnesium.

What’s the connection between the two metals?

Almost all structural aluminium in use is duraluminium. You need magnesium for duraluminium alloys.

Re: A $5B hoard of aluminum

#22
post #19
post #17

The industry around the world is running out of aluminium. Aluminium mills are closing all around the globe, except for China. Why? No magnesium. And China don't let out its magnesium.

What’s the connection between the two metals?

"Aluminum" is sold and used as an alloy, not as pure elemental Al. 6061 grade aluminum for instance has ~1% magnesium.

Re: A $5B hoard of aluminum

#23
post #17

The industry around the world is running out of aluminium. Aluminium mills are closing all around the globe, except for China. Why? No magnesium. And China don't let out its magnesium.

China produces most of the world magnesium supply. Production is down due to electrical power shortages and they have restricted exports in order to ensure supply for domestic needs.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-10-27/magnesium-shortage-in...

Re: A $5B hoard of aluminum

#24
post #20

Only as a side note/curiosity, possibly one of the most valued sets of cutlery Napoleon III owned was an aluminium one: https://history.stackexchange.com/questions/51115/did-napole... Anyway until the late second half of the 1800's, it was considered as valuable as gold, if not more (article in French): https://journals.openedition.org/archeosciences/560

Until exceptionally abundant electricity and the Hall-Heroult process, a french guy whose name I forgot discovered you could burn bauxite under a vacuum with elemental sodium. Which meant it was like a twenty step process that burned off other really expensive difficult materials to make.

Wild stuff.

Re: A $5B hoard of aluminum

#25
post #17

The industry around the world is running out of aluminium. Aluminium mills are closing all around the globe, except for China. Why? No magnesium. And China don't let out its magnesium.

Hmm. Magnesium is anything but scarce -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnesium#Occurrence

OTOH, it's not used in huge quantities (vs. oil, coal, iron, etc.) - so it seem plausible that China could kinda corner the market. At a reasonable cost (for them). Especially if they're the ~only country bothering to run a strategy...

Re: A $5B hoard of aluminum

#26
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might be in specific forms ready to be processed - eg. blocks of specific dimensions or weights. After 10 years outside, it's probably covered in dust and grime, and gotten an oxide layer. It probably isn't immediately sellable to a car factory... But it could be reprocessed very inexpensively and become sellable. The loss of value would probably be well under 1%. People saying "it's so old, it's basically scrap"…

> and gotten an oxide layer Aluminium has an oxide layer the second it comes into contact with air.

It keeps increasing (exponentially slower, thus with a finite total depth) even without any other chemical.

Anyway, out on the world there are many chemicals that can make it deeper, can peel it from the metal so another layer forms, or can mix with it and make it less insulating. I would be surprised if loses are as low as 1% as people point on this thread, but shouldn't be very large either.

Re: A $5B hoard of aluminum

#27

The aluminum market is a game. https://www.cnbc.com/2014/06/03/how-aluminum-became-a-cash-c...

And according to https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/40538538 , it always has been. In the referenced book, the author details how the aluminum cartel was dismantled under the threat of WWII needs because of their failure to promptly address the needs of the United States.

My recollection was that the Washington Monument has an aluminum cap on account of the material's status as a precious material at the time. What I found at the below link is a story of "fake it until you make it" pushing of materials science and self-promotion worthy of an HN read.

https://www.tms.org/pubs/journals/jom/9511/binczewski-9511.h...

Re: A $5B hoard of aluminum

#29
the aluminium industry consumed 6% of all global coal-fired electricity in 2019 – more coal-fired electricity than is generated in the whole of Europe – and is actually becoming more reliant on coal at a time when the world is becoming less reliant on coal.

https://ember-climate.org/commentary/2020/10/06/aluminium/

The aluminium sector has a pivotal role to play here. Accounting for 1.1 billion tonnes of CO2 emissions per year, it generates around 2% of global human-caused emissions. Demand for aluminium, an essential material for several key industries including construction, transportation and power transmission, is expected to grow by more than 50% by 2050. As such, emissions must be addressed now.

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/11/the-aluminium-industr...

Re: A $5B hoard of aluminum

#30
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might be in specific forms ready to be processed - eg. blocks of specific dimensions or weights. After 10 years outside, it's probably covered in dust and grime, and gotten an oxide layer. It probably isn't immediately sellable to a car factory... But it could be reprocessed very inexpensively and become sellable. The loss of value would probably be well under 1%. People saying "it's so old, it's basically scrap"…

I have a 1983 Honda and the aluminum shines like a mirror. It didn’t always. When I got it the metal looked dull and weather possible damaged. It is amazing what buffing it can do. From garbage to mirror finish. Very satisfying to watch aluminum being polished. The aluminum did loses some of the outer layer that had oxidizes but looks brand new once cleaned up. Looks new and has the structural integrity to be used in…

Old Airstream trailers (1950s-1990s at least) can be buffed to a mirror-like finish.

Oddly, new Airstreams seem to come pre-oxidized. Not sure if this is a design choice, or if they don't use aluminum any more.

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