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Valve opens up a Steam Deck to explain why it thinks you shouldn’t

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Re: Valve opens up a Steam Deck to explain why it thinks you shouldn’t

#21

Post by genocidicbunny »

lmilcin wrote: post #20
colejohnson66 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US, the FCC has made it clear in recent years that “warranty void if removed” stickers are illegal. Manufacturers can only void the warranty if they can show that any defects are caused by your tinkering.

Well somehow I missed that (and also I am from Poland which means the sticker is still enforceable here). But being amateur electronics engineer myself I actually agree with the "warranty void if opened". Handling electronics safely is not trivial and if you touch electronics with your bare hand you can easily damage it due to static discharge. And there is going to be no way of telling who is exactly responsible for…

I think you and the parent comment agree. Just opening an electronic device is not necessarily damaging to it. The damage is done by improper handling.

The FCCs argument is based on the notion that as long as you handle the device correctly, the manufacturer shouldn't be able to deny warranty _just_ because you opened it. You need to actually damage the device to lose out on warranty service.

Re: Valve opens up a Steam Deck to explain why it thinks you shouldn’t

#22

Post by ranguna »

tediousdemise wrote: post #12
colejohnson66 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can’t have tiny surface mount components packed onto the PCBs in phones without trade offs in repaiability. No one[a] is going to buy a game console made of discrete logic and through hole passives when the PS5, X Box, and Switch do a much better job at giving consumers what they want with 0402 (or smaller) passives. I applaud Valve for doing this video. They’re admitting that the device is too complex for the av…

You’re strawmanning my argument by picking components least likely to be repaired or replaced by the average user, completely dodging the usual suspects. Non-removable batteries are almost always the first parts that go bad in handheld devices, and there are absolutely no excuses for using them other than greed and incompetence.

Not dodging, we are talking about the steam deck here, so it's 100% on point.

Your original argument is the one that's doging the fact that we are on a steam deck thread.

Re: Valve opens up a Steam Deck to explain why it thinks you shouldn’t

#23

Post by Doxin »

> The company cautions that they are completely custom, but says that it will offer a source for “replacement parts, thumbsticks, SSDs, and possibly more” in the coming months.

There you go. that's how you do right to repair.

Of course in an ideal world they'd also design the device to be easy to repair, but this is a massive leap in the right direction IMO.

Re: Valve opens up a Steam Deck to explain why it thinks you shouldn’t

#25

Post by exporectomy »

tediousdemise wrote: post #12
colejohnson66 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can’t have tiny surface mount components packed onto the PCBs in phones without trade offs in repaiability. No one[a] is going to buy a game console made of discrete logic and through hole passives when the PS5, X Box, and Switch do a much better job at giving consumers what they want with 0402 (or smaller) passives. I applaud Valve for doing this video. They’re admitting that the device is too complex for the av…

You’re strawmanning my argument by picking components least likely to be repaired or replaced by the average user, completely dodging the usual suspects. Non-removable batteries are almost always the first parts that go bad in handheld devices, and there are absolutely no excuses for using them other than greed and incompetence.

What do you mean by non-removable battery? The video shows how to unplug it. I'm sure it can be replaced by any normal repairman or hobbyist. Aftermarket batteries will also surely be available like they are for other popular devices.

Re: Valve opens up a Steam Deck to explain why it thinks you shouldn’t

#26

Post by lmilcin »

genocidicbunny wrote: post #21
lmilcin wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well somehow I missed that (and also I am from Poland which means the sticker is still enforceable here). But being amateur electronics engineer myself I actually agree with the "warranty void if opened". Handling electronics safely is not trivial and if you touch electronics with your bare hand you can easily damage it due to static discharge. And there is going to be no way of telling who is exactly responsible for…

I think you and the parent comment agree. Just opening an electronic device is not necessarily damaging to it. The damage is done by improper handling. The FCCs argument is based on the notion that as long as you handle the device correctly, the manufacturer shouldn't be able to deny warranty _just_ because you opened it. You need to actually damage the device to lose out on warranty service.

What I mean is that it is almost never possible to prove who caused ESD damage. It just fries some unfortunate internal part of some integrated circuit.

And I can understand companies not wanting to deal with this.

When I design electronics I often think of how to make it resistant from people touching it on the outside (ports, enclosure, etc.) but there is about nothing I can do to prevent it getting killed due to direct touching the PCB.

And newer designs are only getting more and more fragile. This mainly due to more and more of the circuit being integrated in chips (so when you touch it it is more likely to hit directly a chip), faster communication paths (so they have less capacitance which could be helpful in filtering the shock) and finer manufacturing process (the chips themselves are less and less resistant to ESD).

Re: Valve opens up a Steam Deck to explain why it thinks you shouldn’t

#27

Post by MrGilbert »

Doxin wrote: post #23

> The company cautions that they are completely custom, but says that it will offer a source for “replacement parts, thumbsticks, SSDs, and possibly more” in the coming months. There you go. that's how you do right to repair. Of course in an ideal world they'd also design the device to be easy to repair, but this is a massive leap in the right direction IMO.

Exactly that. I get the impression that some commenters here didn't even bother to watch the video or read the description / article. Valve will provide spare parts, and from what I saw so far, it seems repairable. If they don't "dongle" things (looking at you, Apple!), it will still be servable.

Re: Valve opens up a Steam Deck to explain why it thinks you shouldn’t

#28

Post by solarkraft »

Poor iFixit. But this is exactly how you do it.

People are curious what it looks inside and you don’t want them to open it? Just show them what’s inside and take their reason to open it.

It’s similar to warnings. “Don’t do x” is easy to not take seriously since people can say it for all kinds of reasons, “... because it would kill you” is pretty convincing.

Re: Valve opens up a Steam Deck to explain why it thinks you shouldn’t

#29

Post by conradludgate »

Remember. Right to repair isn't necessarily about having repairs or upgrades be super easy and anyone can do it. But to make the parts, schematics and information accessible by those that are trained to repair and upgrade them.

You can repair a car. Doesn't mean you should repair your own car. Making a mistake can be dangerous. But professionals who know what they are doing have easy access to components and information about the layout of your cars internals if they need them.

Re: Valve opens up a Steam Deck to explain why it thinks you shouldn’t

#30

Post by occamrazor »

lmilcin wrote: post #20
colejohnson66 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US, the FCC has made it clear in recent years that “warranty void if removed” stickers are illegal. Manufacturers can only void the warranty if they can show that any defects are caused by your tinkering.

Well somehow I missed that (and also I am from Poland which means the sticker is still enforceable here). But being amateur electronics engineer myself I actually agree with the "warranty void if opened". Handling electronics safely is not trivial and if you touch electronics with your bare hand you can easily damage it due to static discharge. And there is going to be no way of telling who is exactly responsible for…

Poland is in the EU, the sticker is not enforceable. The seller (not the manufacturer) must provide two years of statutory warranty.
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