Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year • Hacker News Board

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#21

Post by marvin » Wed, Oct 06, 2021, 9:00 PM UTC

thomasfl wrote: post #14

There's a huge price difference between electric cars and gas fueled cars here in Norway. Gas fueled car buyers have to pay both 25 percent VAT and an additional tax on purchase. Buyers don't have to pay neither of those taxes if they buy an electric car. The singer of the group A-ha, Morten Harket, bought an electrical car in 1989 and refused to pay road tolls and ignored all the subsequent fines. That got a lot of…

Would be interesting to eventually hear Elon Musk's thoughts on Norway's role in Tesla's success. We were a very big market for them in 2013-2018, one might suspect critical.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#22

Post by toomuchtodo » Wed, Oct 06, 2021, 9:00 PM UTC

AustinDev wrote: post #16

dtech wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least they are using that money for citizens and green energy instead of Ferrari's of the royal family

Ferarris don't contribute at all to global warming relatively. The many Gulfstream's and 747's the wealthy own are actually statistically significant in terms of impact.

The House of Saud, for some time, has attempted and failed to diversify away from oil wealth for when the time comes they can no longer rely on it. Norway, arguably, will reach that point soon (as they’ve bootstrapped electric mobility and can now deprecate existing petroleum supply chains, both for domestic use and for export).

Be like Norway and use the time you have left selling a natural resource wisely, because bans and cross border tariffs are coming, and you’ll be left with what you could build during your transition when the revenue dries up. Hopefully as a country, you don’t end up empty handed.

(Norway also supplies the UK with a large amount of clean hydro power, roughly 690MW continuous, through a newly commissioned underwater HVDC transmission line, so it’s not all dirty fossil exports)

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#23

Post by thomasfl » Wed, Oct 06, 2021, 9:01 PM UTC

WalterBright wrote: post #5

20% of Norway's GDP comes from pumping oil out of the ground and selling it for others to burn. If they were really green that would stop.

As a Norwegian I totally agree with you. It is not just unethical, but stupid to invest so much in searching for new old fields. When demand for oil drops, Norway could have a Kodak moment.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#24

Post by kmonsen » Wed, Oct 06, 2021, 9:01 PM UTC

tannhaeuser wrote: post #2

Isn't that a strange thing, considering Norway is vast, has low population density especially in the north, and has own oil resources available?

That's why it's not going to be 100%. Just someone looking at a graph and extrapolating.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#25

Post by iddan » Wed, Oct 06, 2021, 9:02 PM UTC

thomasfl wrote: post #14

There's a huge price difference between electric cars and gas fueled cars here in Norway. Gas fueled car buyers have to pay both 25 percent VAT and an additional tax on purchase. Buyers don't have to pay neither of those taxes if they buy an electric car. The singer of the group A-ha, Morten Harket, bought an electrical car in 1989 and refused to pay road tolls and ignored all the subsequent fines. That got a lot of…

That is a a great way of using social impact for the environment. Celebs should really how can they actions like this

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#26

Post by outside1234 » Wed, Oct 06, 2021, 9:03 PM UTC

tuatoru wrote: post #7

tannhaeuser wrote: post #2

Isn't that a strange thing, considering Norway is vast, has low population density especially in the north, and has own oil resources available?

Norway is wealthy thanks to selling fossil fuels. Norwegians feel guilty about that, but not guilty enough to stop selling them. This is essentially performative environmentalism from them. Still, it will help other countries by throwing up unforeseen problems in all-electric ground transportation, and some solutions.

They also get the shit taxed out of them for buying a IC car, so electric cars are actually cheaper.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#27

Post by kmonsen » Wed, Oct 06, 2021, 9:03 PM UTC

belltaco wrote: post #9

WalterBright wrote: post #5

20% of Norway's GDP comes from pumping oil out of the ground and selling it for others to burn. If they were really green that would stop.

Stopping it would be useless, it'd just increase production from oil wells of other countries. They could invest that money into accelerating green technology.

That's not useless though. It would drive the price up making it easier to scale up on renewables.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#28

Post by oleganza » Wed, Oct 06, 2021, 9:05 PM UTC

bellyfullofbac wrote: post #8

What a weird forecast, this is like saying "Bitcoin will hit $100k in 3 months." by looking at the price graph. Since people will still be allowed to buy such cars so far, I doubt 100% will ever be reached...

Actually, Bitcoin is likely to hit $100K in about 3 months.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#29

Post by tkbeili » Wed, Oct 06, 2021, 9:05 PM UTC

thomasfl wrote: post #14

There's a huge price difference between electric cars and gas fueled cars here in Norway. Gas fueled car buyers have to pay both 25 percent VAT and an additional tax on purchase. Buyers don't have to pay neither of those taxes if they buy an electric car. The singer of the group A-ha, Morten Harket, bought an electrical car in 1989 and refused to pay road tolls and ignored all the subsequent fines. That got a lot of…

Very interesting. In Canada, it will take years to recoup the price difference for buying an electric car even with government incentives. 25% VAT + Extra tax seems to work.

Re: Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year

#30

Post by cecilpl2 » Wed, Oct 06, 2021, 9:06 PM UTC

belltaco wrote: post #9

WalterBright wrote: post #5

20% of Norway's GDP comes from pumping oil out of the ground and selling it for others to burn. If they were really green that would stop.

Stopping it would be useless, it'd just increase production from oil wells of other countries. They could invest that money into accelerating green technology.

To a first order effect, stopping production would decrease supply, increasing price, and therefore decreasing demand and therefore overall oil usage, shifting some energy to alternative sources.

Of course second order effects might dwarf that, like the fact that increasing prices would incentivize oil extraction in currently unprofitable locations. That extraction may or may not be more carbon-intensive than Norway's (though probably more if it's currently unprofitable).

It sounds punchy to say "Norway should stop extracting oil" as much as it does to say "It doesn't matter whether they do or not since someone else will", but the reality is much more complex than either of those simplistic zeroth-order approximations.