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Introducing Age Verification

blog.roblox.com

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Re: Introducing Age Verification

#21

Post by donmcronald »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #3
kosei wrote: post #2

Though I applaud the effort to get age right and protect players, I'm not sure I'll ever be comfortable having me or my child scan our photo ID and selfie to upload it as part of a login flow to an application.

A component of my work is in digital identity, so I hope you don’t mind the question: what would make you comfortable doing so? For Roblox, I can see the exception taken, but some applications do require this level of identity proofing (scanning your passport in an airline mobile app to book an international flight comes to mind). Edit: Thank you everyone for your feedback, it’s very helpful!

I did it for a crypto exchange, but that was for KYC / AML verification and I intentionally chose an exchange that's regulated by my country's KYC/AML regulator, so I was expecting to have to do it.

Giving up that much PII for a game is insane. I'd uninstall it without even thinking. Any industry that's not regulated to require photo ID when they're asking for it doesn't need to ask for it.

Re: Introducing Age Verification

#23

Post by scohesc »

gruez wrote: post #11
toomuchtodo wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Children's Online Privacy Protection Rule ("COPPA") https://www.ftc.gov/enforcement/rules/rulemaking-regulatory-... EDIT: @gruez: An attestion is likely no longer sufficient for Roblox's compliance requirements, and identity proofing is now cheap to perform (~$1-2/per proofing request). Cheaper to get ahead of the curve. https://www.theverge.com/2021/9/21/22684672/roblox-age-verif... > For now, only one feature requi…

That piece of legislation was from 21 years ago. What changed? In the past a "I'm 13" checkbox would have sufficed.

I'm sure it's more of a "cover your ass" scenario where in the future, if someone gets past the ID verification system and uses an account to commit a crime on their platform, Roblox can just say "the ID company verified it!"

Re: Introducing Age Verification

#24

Post by fouric »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #3
kosei wrote: post #2

Though I applaud the effort to get age right and protect players, I'm not sure I'll ever be comfortable having me or my child scan our photo ID and selfie to upload it as part of a login flow to an application.

A component of my work is in digital identity, so I hope you don’t mind the question: what would make you comfortable doing so? For Roblox, I can see the exception taken, but some applications do require this level of identity proofing (scanning your passport in an airline mobile app to book an international flight comes to mind). Edit: Thank you everyone for your feedback, it’s very helpful!

Not OP, but:

If at all possible, I would want a hard guarantee that my photo ID and all derived information (e.g. my real name (as in the case of Roblox, they don't care about your identity, just your age)) would be completely deleted as soon as possible, as well as a description of exactly when that would be (e.g. "we have to contact your federal government to verify the authenticity of this ID, and then ensure that they know that we've verified your user account, and then we'll delete everything immediately - this typically take 4-8 business days, and we'll email you when the process is completed").

Regardless of the above, I would require that no personal information linked to my ID would be used for any purpose (analytics, marketing, ads, or sale/transfer to a third party) except identity verification.

Re: Introducing Age Verification

#25

Post by donmcronald »

judge2020 wrote: post #20
donmcronald wrote: post #14

First off... NOT A FUCKING CHANCE. If a kid came to me with a game that was asking for "opt in" age verification by scanning government ID, and they wanted to do it, we'd have a long talk about privacy and that game would get uninstalled even if it means the end result is the kid crying over it. Second, how is this going to work? I don't know a single kid that plays Roblox and has a government issued photo ID. And ar…

> Second, how is this going to work? I don't know a single kid that plays Roblox and has a government issued photo ID. Chances are their age verification system only applies if you say you’re 18+. I doubt they’re going to throw away players.

> It will be available globally in over 180 countries on both mobile and desktop for anyone 13 years of age or older with a government-issued ID or passport.

That's a quick ticket to getting a lot of 13-16 year old forbidden (by parents) from playing your game IMO.

Re: Introducing Age Verification

#26

Post by droopyEyelids »

gruez wrote: post #11
toomuchtodo wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Children's Online Privacy Protection Rule ("COPPA") https://www.ftc.gov/enforcement/rules/rulemaking-regulatory-... EDIT: @gruez: An attestion is likely no longer sufficient for Roblox's compliance requirements, and identity proofing is now cheap to perform (~$1-2/per proofing request). Cheaper to get ahead of the curve. https://www.theverge.com/2021/9/21/22684672/roblox-age-verif... > For now, only one feature requi…

That piece of legislation was from 21 years ago. What changed? In the past a "I'm 13" checkbox would have sufficed.

There are truly unsavory elements that will intrude on a virtual environment for children. Roblox corp knows exactly what they're dealing with due to their existing support requests- and they can imagine the implications of adding a spacial voice feature into that mix.

I trust they're not going overboard here.

Re: Introducing Age Verification

#28

Post by zerkten »

gruez wrote: post #11
toomuchtodo wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Children's Online Privacy Protection Rule ("COPPA") https://www.ftc.gov/enforcement/rules/rulemaking-regulatory-... EDIT: @gruez: An attestion is likely no longer sufficient for Roblox's compliance requirements, and identity proofing is now cheap to perform (~$1-2/per proofing request). Cheaper to get ahead of the curve. https://www.theverge.com/2021/9/21/22684672/roblox-age-verif... > For now, only one feature requi…

That piece of legislation was from 21 years ago. What changed? In the past a "I'm 13" checkbox would have sufficed.

I don't think anything has changed, but COPPA isn't the only regulation with age requirements. GDPR also includes age requirement (https://gdpr-info.eu/art-8-gdpr/).

From a quick read of the article, I think this is intentionally going beyond the requirements. They obviously feel that this will build a safer and more trustworthy environment at the expense of other issues, including a loss of users who don't want to provide identity.

Re: Introducing Age Verification

#30

Post by michaelt »

ollien wrote: post #5
scohesc wrote: post #4

I understand the massive investments into "rolling your own" system for ID verification, but I always feel sketched out when companies ask you to send your ID and your photo to "a third-party" - where the privacy terms of that relationship are so obtuse/vague it's not worth reading. Is it really that hard on the privacy front to hire someone to keep watch and manually verify that someone is who they say they are? I a…

I'd feel _more_ sketched out if a provider was handling it themselves. I don't know how much I want someone unqualified handling the storage of this themselves...

What seems really sketchy to me is the third party together with a lot of the language in the press release - Roblox does not store raw ID document nor the selfie data.
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