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Breakthrough Cases May Be a Bigger Problem Than You’ve Been Told

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Re: Breakthrough Cases May Be a Bigger Problem Than You’ve Been Told

#21

Post by peytn »

deegles wrote: post #19
NonContro wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should people with natural immunity from previous exposure get it? Natural immunity provides broader protection because antibodies are generated for more of the virus, instead of just the spike protein in the case of vaccines. If there is negligible additional protection then why take the risk of vaccine injury? Why can't antibody tests be regarded in the same way as vaccination for 'passport' purposes? The CDC e…

The science on this is clear, please update your stance. Natural immunity is not as protective as vaccine induced immunity. It is in fact 2.3x more likely that you will get reinfected while unvaccinated, and a stronger immune response from the vaccine means fewer people end up hospitalized. See: > Reduced Risk of Reinfection with SARS-CoV-2 After COVID-19 Vaccination https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7032e1.ht…

From your link:

> these findings cannot be used to infer causation

Do you have more data to support your claims?

Re: Breakthrough Cases May Be a Bigger Problem Than You’ve Been Told

#22

Post by Mattasher »

hellified wrote: post #18
Mattasher wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sweden "went back to normal" a long time ago. Their Covid deaths rate is near zero. The "it's bad so we need to x" reflex, where x is any of masking mandates, social distancing, or especially take kids out of school, is anti-science and anti-human.

I'm living in Sweden right now (US citizen). We wear masks. I've been working from home at my employer's request for over a year now. Office buildings are pretty empty, restaurants are still mostly depending on takeout revenue. Our vaccination rate is higher than in the US, and we're still being sensibly cautious to prevent another wave. Sweden isn't the free-for-all zone you've been led to believe.

I was there at the end of 2020. Almost no one wore masks in Stockholm, even coming out of the subway less than 1%.

Re: Breakthrough Cases May Be a Bigger Problem Than You’ve Been Told

#23

Post by theodric »

voakbasda wrote: post #15
Eldt wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Didn't Sweden have a lot more deaths than their neighbours?

Small price to pay for herd immunity and normalcy, if it actually worked.

Spoken like someone who didn't die.

Also ghoulish beyond belief.

Re: Breakthrough Cases May Be a Bigger Problem Than You’ve Been Told

#24

Post by SideburnsOfDoom »

chiefalchemist wrote: post #2

If the jab mitigates the symptoms but the (unaware) carrier can still transmit the virus to others, then doesn't that help the virus? It doesn't stop it, it gives it cover, a disguise.

> If the jab mitigates the symptoms but the (unaware) carrier can still transmit the virus to others, then doesn't that help the virus?

You have assumed that "can" means "will do so at the same rate"

Which is not true. So, no, it does not help the virus.

Same question here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28151989

Re: Breakthrough Cases May Be a Bigger Problem Than You’ve Been Told

#25

Post by nradov »

HarryHirsch wrote: post #4
chiefalchemist wrote: post #2

If the jab mitigates the symptoms but the (unaware) carrier can still transmit the virus to others, then doesn't that help the virus? It doesn't stop it, it gives it cover, a disguise.

Let's be real: what helps the virus is politicians (actually commercial landlords, the politicians are just the mouthpiece) wanting to go back to normal. Proper public messaging would insist on continued social distancing instead of going back to schools and offices in the fall.

You can't seriously expect people to continue social distancing. The virus is here to stay. It can't be eradicated because the vaccines aren't fully sterilizing and there are also animal hosts. The vast majority of us will eventually get infected regardless of what infection control measures we take. We'll just have to accept the risk and move on. Fortunately the vaccines are very safe and highly effective at preventing deaths.

Re: Breakthrough Cases May Be a Bigger Problem Than You’ve Been Told

#26

Post by blueprint »

nradov wrote: post #25
HarryHirsch wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's be real: what helps the virus is politicians (actually commercial landlords, the politicians are just the mouthpiece) wanting to go back to normal. Proper public messaging would insist on continued social distancing instead of going back to schools and offices in the fall.

You can't seriously expect people to continue social distancing. The virus is here to stay. It can't be eradicated because the vaccines aren't fully sterilizing and there are also animal hosts. The vast majority of us will eventually get infected regardless of what infection control measures we take. We'll just have to accept the risk and move on. Fortunately the vaccines are very safe and highly effective at prevent…

It's not that hard to go outside to cafes and still social distance - but people are not doing it. That's the difference.

Re: Breakthrough Cases May Be a Bigger Problem Than You’ve Been Told

#27

Post by dotcommand »

deegles wrote: post #19
NonContro wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should people with natural immunity from previous exposure get it? Natural immunity provides broader protection because antibodies are generated for more of the virus, instead of just the spike protein in the case of vaccines. If there is negligible additional protection then why take the risk of vaccine injury? Why can't antibody tests be regarded in the same way as vaccination for 'passport' purposes? The CDC e…

The science on this is clear, please update your stance. Natural immunity is not as protective as vaccine induced immunity. It is in fact 2.3x more likely that you will get reinfected while unvaccinated, and a stronger immune response from the vaccine means fewer people end up hospitalized. See: > Reduced Risk of Reinfection with SARS-CoV-2 After COVID-19 Vaccination https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7032e1.ht…

> The science on this is clear, please update your stance.

You are conflating science with "stats".

> Natural immunity is not as protective as vaccine induced immunity.

If that is true and if the science is clear, then why is that the case? What is the biological mechanism behind that? Shouldn't natural immunity be better in most cases since your body is actually fighting the real disease? Since you say the "science is clear", can you explain the science behind it?

> It is in fact 2.3x more likely that you will get reinfected while unvaccinated, and a stronger immune response from the vaccine means fewer people end up hospitalized. See:

From your link...

"Finally, this is a retrospective study design using data from a single state during a 2-month period; therefore, these findings cannot be used to infer causation. Additional prospective studies with larger populations are warranted to support these findings."

So you say the science is clear and then you link to a study that explicitly says not to infer any causation?

You literally spread FUD and misinformation. As seems to be the case of so many invested in this covid narrative on both sides.

Re: Breakthrough Cases May Be a Bigger Problem Than You’ve Been Told

#28

Post by nradov »

Eldt wrote: post #10
Mattasher wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sweden "went back to normal" a long time ago. Their Covid deaths rate is near zero. The "it's bad so we need to x" reflex, where x is any of masking mandates, social distancing, or especially take kids out of school, is anti-science and anti-human.

Didn't Sweden have a lot more deaths than their neighbours?

What do you count as a neighbor? Sweden is 39th in the world by per capita death rate. Many other European countries have higher death rates, including some countries that took more extensive pandemic control measures.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

Re: Breakthrough Cases May Be a Bigger Problem Than You’ve Been Told

#29

Post by randomopining »

NonContro wrote: post #16
randomopining wrote: post #6

Everybody should get vaccinated and then get it now. The current Delta is close enough to the OG version that your body can crush it and then get a stronger immunity towards the future lineage of the virus. If you stay in a bubble, by this winter there will be a variant that almost completely evades the vaccines and then you're back to square one. Basically we should be continuously getting immunity against the newes…

Why should people with natural immunity from previous exposure get it? Natural immunity provides broader protection because antibodies are generated for more of the virus, instead of just the spike protein in the case of vaccines. If there is negligible additional protection then why take the risk of vaccine injury? Why can't antibody tests be regarded in the same way as vaccination for 'passport' purposes? The CDC e…

What's the risk of vaccine injury?

If the percentage chance of serious vaccine injury is many times less than the chance of somewhat serious covid or long covid... a logical person would take the vaccine.

If you just had covid and had a mild or moderate case, yes I could accept not getting a vaccine.

What i'm talking about is moreso that people should get vaccine immunity, and then get the delta so that we don't fall too far behind in general immunity.

Re: Breakthrough Cases May Be a Bigger Problem Than You’ve Been Told

#30

Post by sjg007 »

Mattasher wrote: post #8
HarryHirsch wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's be real: what helps the virus is politicians (actually commercial landlords, the politicians are just the mouthpiece) wanting to go back to normal. Proper public messaging would insist on continued social distancing instead of going back to schools and offices in the fall.

Sweden "went back to normal" a long time ago. Their Covid deaths rate is near zero. The "it's bad so we need to x" reflex, where x is any of masking mandates, social distancing, or especially take kids out of school, is anti-science and anti-human.

Things are not normal in Sweden.

https://www.thelocal.se/20210812/in-numbers-covid-19-cases-c...

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