Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

twitter.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 757 posts

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#21

Post by zepto »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #3

So if I understand correctly, they want to scan all your photos, stored on your private phone, that you paid for, and they want to check if any of the hashes are the same as hashes of child porn? So... all your hashes will be uploaded to the cloud? How do you prevent them from scanning other stuff (memes, leaked documents, trump-fights-cnn-gif,... to profile the users)? Or will a huge hash database of child porn hash…

No, your hashes are not uploaded to the cloud, yes, hashes are downloaded to your phone. Yes, it will be interesting to see if it gets spammed with false positives, although it seems as though that can easily be identified silently to the user.

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#23

Post by nbzso »

Since Snowden I use my phone in minimalistic way. Phone calls. Minimal texting. No games. Banking apps if necessary.

Treat your phones as an enemy. Use real computers with VPN and software like Little Snitch when online. Use cameras for photography and video.

The benefits of this approach are immense. I have long attention span. I don't have fear of missing out.

If governments wan't the future to be painted by tracing and surveillance mediated towards people trough big tech - lets make it mandatory by law. And since big tech will reap benefits from the big data they must provide phones for free. :)

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#24

Post by ajsnigrutin »

Spivak wrote: post #16
BluSyn wrote: post #6

I understand the hesitation here, but fundamentally this is like trying to close pandoras box. If something is technically possible to do AND governments demand it be done, it will be done. If not by Apple, by someone else. Rather than complain about it, I am interested in what alternative solutions exist, or how concerns regarding privacy and abuse of this system could be mitigated.

It’s not trying to close Pandora’s box. It’s liability limitation. They’re effectively saying that if you want to distribute CP don’t do it on an iPhone.

They're basically saying, that they're watching all your multimedia, to see if maybe you're distributing child porn. This is like doing rectal exams on everyone, every day, because someone might be hiding drugs there.

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#25

Post by echelon »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #3

So if I understand correctly, they want to scan all your photos, stored on your private phone, that you paid for, and they want to check if any of the hashes are the same as hashes of child porn? So... all your hashes will be uploaded to the cloud? How do you prevent them from scanning other stuff (memes, leaked documents, trump-fights-cnn-gif,... to profile the users)? Or will a huge hash database of child porn hash…

That document you downloaded that is critical of the party will land you and your family in jail. Enjoy your iPhone.

Seriously, folks, we shouldn't celebrate Apple's death grip over their platform. It's dangerous for all of us. The more of you that use it, the more it creates a sort of "anti-herd immunity" towards totalitarian control.

Apple talks "privacy", but jfc they're nothing of the sort. Apple gives zero shits about your privacy. They're staking more ground against Facebook and Google, trying to take their beachheads. You're just a pawn in the game for long term control.

Apple cares just as much for your privacy as they do your "freedom" to run your own (un-taxed) software or repair your devices (for cheaper).

And after Tim Cook is replaced with a new regime, you'll be powerless to stop the further erosion of your liberties. It'll be too late.

Stop. Using. Apple.

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#26

Post by Causality1 »

dannyw wrote: post #15
TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m sure It’s in the TOS.

To start scanning my local photos on my local phone and report back?

I'm fairly sure the ToS says Apple can do whatever it wants whenever it wants as long as it isn't blatantly illegal. Recall when they decided everyone needed a Bono album on their phone without consent.

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#27

Post by bigiain »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #3

So if I understand correctly, they want to scan all your photos, stored on your private phone, that you paid for, and they want to check if any of the hashes are the same as hashes of child porn? So... all your hashes will be uploaded to the cloud? How do you prevent them from scanning other stuff (memes, leaked documents, trump-fights-cnn-gif,... to profile the users)? Or will a huge hash database of child porn hash…

> and they want to check if any of the hashes are the same as hashes of child porn?

... without any technical guarantee or auditability that any of the hashes they're alerting on are actually of child porn.

How much would you bet against law enforcement to abuse their ability to use this, and add hashes to find out who's got anti government memes or police committing murder images on their phones?

And that's just in "there land of the free", how much worst will the abuse of this be in countries who, say, bonesaw journalists to pieces while they are alive?

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#28

Post by gruez »

nbzso wrote: post #23

Since Snowden I use my phone in minimalistic way. Phone calls. Minimal texting. No games. Banking apps if necessary. Treat your phones as an enemy. Use real computers with VPN and software like Little Snitch when online. Use cameras for photography and video. The benefits of this approach are immense. I have long attention span. I don't have fear of missing out. If governments wan't the future to be painted by tracin…

>Treat your phones as an enemy. Use real computers with VPN and software like Little Snitch when online.

I'm assuming your "real computer" is a mac (since little snitch is mac only). What makes you think apple won't do the same for macos? Also, while you have greater control with a "real computer", you also have less privacy from the apps themselves, since they're unsandboxed and have full access to your system.

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#29

Post by djd7duehrj »

nbzso wrote: post #23

Since Snowden I use my phone in minimalistic way. Phone calls. Minimal texting. No games. Banking apps if necessary. Treat your phones as an enemy. Use real computers with VPN and software like Little Snitch when online. Use cameras for photography and video. The benefits of this approach are immense. I have long attention span. I don't have fear of missing out. If governments wan't the future to be painted by tracin…

If you're treating your phone as hostile why would you skip gaming apps but use banking ones? That seems backwards if you're assuming your mobile is the weak point.

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#30

Post by bigiain »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #20
srswtf123 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you 100% — the only solution I’ve found workable is limiting my use of the technology itself as much as possible.

Or regulation saying that this is illegal, because it invades users privacy too much.

Which'd be fine if we had one global government with world wide jurisdiction. Or technology choices from companies which couldn't be pressured by governments outside your personal regulation jurisdiction.

I wouldn't hold your breath waiting for those regulations to become law in, say, Chine or Turkey or Saudi Arabia. I'd bet even Israel won't pass them, surely NSO have enough political lobbying swing (and probably also suitable blackmail material on sitting politicians).

Post reply on HN