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41 percent of consumers say their next car will be electric

arstechnica.com

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Re: 41 percent of consumers say their next car will be electric

#21

Post by turtlebits »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #3

I’ve known a lot of people to say this, only to buy a gas powered vehicle when they realize that Teslas aren’t as cheap as they thought. The price gets even higher when they realize they need to hire an electrician to install a charging station for several thousand dollars. A Tesla Model 3 base model in white with no options will cost $41K with destination charge and no self-driving. Upgrade to the long range model,…

I got my Chevy Bolt for 30k. (22.5k with federal subsidy).

If you are taking an 8 hour road trip , it's not a huge stretch to put an 45 min charging session (especially if only twice a year, you're out 90 mins).

Re: 41 percent of consumers say their next car will be electric

#22

Post by turtlebits »

CivBase wrote: post #17

As someone in the USs midwest, EVs are a really tough sell for me. Charging is slow in the best case scenario, charging stations are few and far between, there are few "affordable" options, and it's unclear how well current models will retain their value in 6+ years. I'm hopeful for the tech, but I certainly can't see myself buying a fully electric vehicle before 2030. Most people I know around here seem to have simi…

If you put in a L2 charger, you can charge fully every night (~24mi*12 hours = 288 miles of range).

Agreed on the truck. Or you can just have 1 EV and 1 truck/SUV.

Re: 41 percent of consumers say their next car will be electric

#23

Post by halvo »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #12
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #3

I’ve known a lot of people to say this, only to buy a gas powered vehicle when they realize that Teslas aren’t as cheap as they thought. The price gets even higher when they realize they need to hire an electrician to install a charging station for several thousand dollars. A Tesla Model 3 base model in white with no options will cost $41K with destination charge and no self-driving. Upgrade to the long range model,…

A Model 3 is cheaper over five years than a Camry Hybrid considering total cost of ownership [1]. The cost to install an EV charging station can be as low as $500, but if it does cost more due to having to have your load center/breaker panel replaced, the US government has a 30% tax credit up to $1000 to offset the costs. The Tesla Supercharger network is extensive [2], and continues to grow by the week; charging at…

20-30 minute charge time really shouldn’t be held up as a positive for EVs, it’s still dramatically worse than a stop for gas.

Re: 41 percent of consumers say their next car will be electric

#24

Post by lotsofpulp »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #18
bitcurious wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you look closely at your first source, you’ll notice it’s specific to Australia, and assumes Australian prices for gas and electricity, as well a hugely different depreciation for the two cars. Doing the same math for most American states will punish the Tesla.

US prices for fuel are lower, but so is the cost of electricity in the US. It’s about half the cost per mile to drive an EV vs a light combustion vehicle.

Why is a 5 year cost of ownership relevant when a Toyota has a proven track record of lasting 10 to 20+ years and 200k to 300k+ miles without needing anything other than cheap routine care?

Surely the evidence is stronger for cost per mile and cost per year being lower for a Toyota than a Tesla over the whole lifetime of the vehicle.

Re: 41 percent of consumers say their next car will be electric

#25

Post by tonyedgecombe »

sdflhasjd wrote: post #4

I said this to myself before I bought my last car, but: 1) There doesn't seem to be any practical or socially acceptable way of charging a car that is parked on the street (I don't have a driveway) 2) Electric cars seems to still be significantly more expensive, even used. For what I was willing to pay, I couldn't find anything more than a very basic used leaf. 3) At the affordable end at least: They are so ugly and…

I looked at the numbers when we replaced my wife's car a couple of years ago and it didn't work. We bought a three year old hatchback for £7K with just 13K miles, we will keep it for at least six years. With the low mileage we do there is no way any current EV could get close.

Having said that I doubt we will buy another ICE. At the moment demand is high and supply is constrained so of course the manufacturers are going to concentrate on high margin products. Hopefully this will change as the supply ramps up.

Re: 41 percent of consumers say their next car will be electric

#26

Post by tonyedgecombe »

codeddesign wrote: post #7

I don’t see how this article isn’t cherry picked. - How about those in cold climates where batteries don’t last nearly as long. - upper middle-class and higher only? Most apartments don’t have hookups. Those that do don’t have enough for 10% of the residents. How many home have hookups? How many families have $10k laying around to install hookups? Beyond the fact that it’s not reasonable at all for most Americans, no…

>How about those in cold climates where batteries don’t last nearly as long.

Like Norway where EV's have over 55% of the market?

https://www.electrive.com/2021/04/07/norway-registers-84-8-m...

Re: 41 percent of consumers say their next car will be electric

#27

Post by sharken »

clouddrover wrote: post #8
sharken wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Number 1 is still the major issue, electric cars make sense for those who own a house or has access to an underground car park with charging. If you don't get a Tesla then the infrastructure is still not great. And roaming negotiations to let other electric cars use Teslas charging is still not a thing. For a successful rollout every charging facility has to be available, period. Adding electric charging to gas stati…

> And roaming negotiations to let other electric cars use Teslas charging is still not a thing But soon: https://electrek.co/2021/07/20/elon-musk-confirms-tesla-open...

It will be interesting to see the terms and pricing for this.

Charging speed is still not great, the new Skoda Enyaq iV can charge to 80% capacity in 34 minutes. That translates to 12,6 km/minute for the first 80%.

A 10 year old diesel car can add about 200 km/minute when refueling.

The range for the Enyaq is from 300-600 km, while the diesel car is about 850 km.

A new Skoda Octavia has a range of about 1100 km, so nearly double the range of the Enyaq on a summer day.

So both charging speed and range has a long way to go for EVs.

https://ev-database.org/car/1280/Skoda-Enyaq-iV-80#charge-ta...

Re: 41 percent of consumers say their next car will be electric

#28

Post by sharken »

halvo wrote: post #23
toomuchtodo wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A Model 3 is cheaper over five years than a Camry Hybrid considering total cost of ownership [1]. The cost to install an EV charging station can be as low as $500, but if it does cost more due to having to have your load center/breaker panel replaced, the US government has a 30% tax credit up to $1000 to offset the costs. The Tesla Supercharger network is extensive [2], and continues to grow by the week; charging at…

20-30 minute charge time really shouldn’t be held up as a positive for EVs, it’s still dramatically worse than a stop for gas.

Even newer EVs can only charge to 80% range in 30 minutes, while a stop at the gas tank takes about 5 minutes to refuel to 100% range.

Re: 41 percent of consumers say their next car will be electric

#29

Post by Proven »

Because they are constantly bombarded with higher taxes for ICE cars, fake news about the ability to reverse climate changes, and showered with electric car subsidies.

What is the value of someone's "opinion" in this situation?

The article is junk.

Edit: just saw a laughable comment about the Norwegians finding EVs to be such a great buy. Here you can find the details on how that plunder is funded by the Norwegian taxpayer: https://elbil.no/english/norwegian-ev-policy/

Re: 41 percent of consumers say their next car will be electric

#30

Post by clouddrover »

sharken wrote: post #27
clouddrover wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And roaming negotiations to let other electric cars use Teslas charging is still not a thing But soon: https://electrek.co/2021/07/20/elon-musk-confirms-tesla-open...

It will be interesting to see the terms and pricing for this. Charging speed is still not great, the new Skoda Enyaq iV can charge to 80% capacity in 34 minutes. That translates to 12,6 km/minute for the first 80%. A 10 year old diesel car can add about 200 km/minute when refueling. The range for the Enyaq is from 300-600 km, while the diesel car is about 850 km. A new Skoda Octavia has a range of about 1100 km, so n…

> Charging speed is still not great, the new Skoda Enyaq iV can charge to 80% capacity in 34 minutes.

The Hyundai Ioniq 5 and the Kia EV6 can charge 10% to 80% in 18 minutes. They use the same platform:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCqcqy29ZCc

The charge curve is different from other EVs. It has two peaks. It peaks at around 225 kW initially and then has a second peak at around 175 kW.

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