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We’re all criminals now

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21–30 of 110 posts

Re: We’re all criminals now

#21
post #5

The point of crypto currency is to do the exact thing money laundering laws try to prevent: to transfer large sums of cash untraceably across the globe, with no way for the government to do anything about it. Recently it's become a game of baseless investment, but anyone actually wanting to use crypto currencies as payment should've seen this coming from miles away.

The main interest of governments to ban crypto currency is to levy taxes and have more information on citizenry.

Re: We’re all criminals now

#22
post #5

The point of crypto currency is to do the exact thing money laundering laws try to prevent: to transfer large sums of cash untraceably across the globe, with no way for the government to do anything about it. Recently it's become a game of baseless investment, but anyone actually wanting to use crypto currencies as payment should've seen this coming from miles away.

> The point of crypto currency is to do the exact thing money laundering laws try to prevent

No. That's not the point of cryptocurrency.

> to transfer large sums of cash untraceably across the globe

Wrong again. You can trace all transactions across the globe with cryptocurrency.

> with no way for the government to do anything about it

Why is that a bad thing?

Re: We’re all criminals now

#23
post #12
post #6

Your honor, can the prosecution please be compelled to demonstrate where the bitcoin physically exists? Oh on this computer? Well, the key is memorized and there are several copies saved all over the world in cloud computers. Can the prosecution show the court, physically, where in the computer the asset exists?

How is that different from an asset in a bank account? What matters who controls the access to it.

They can compel the bank directly, no one can "force" the blockchain do to anything that's not programmed to do.

Re: We’re all criminals now

#24
post #5

The point of crypto currency is to do the exact thing money laundering laws try to prevent: to transfer large sums of cash untraceably across the globe, with no way for the government to do anything about it. Recently it's become a game of baseless investment, but anyone actually wanting to use crypto currencies as payment should've seen this coming from miles away.

Yes, let's be real. The vast majority of people who use cryptocurrencies for payments use them because they have no legal alternative. It's the same problem that all privacy focused technologies "suffer" from. When the law is wrong then you have no choice but to break the law but there is no way to distinguish people escaping from an oppressive government and people laundering money from criminal sources. The oppressed and the criminals both take the same bus.

Re: We’re all criminals now

#25
post #5

The point of crypto currency is to do the exact thing money laundering laws try to prevent: to transfer large sums of cash untraceably across the globe, with no way for the government to do anything about it. Recently it's become a game of baseless investment, but anyone actually wanting to use crypto currencies as payment should've seen this coming from miles away.

> The point of crypto currency is to do the exact thing money laundering laws try to prevent No. That's not the point of cryptocurrency. > to transfer large sums of cash untraceably across the globe Wrong again. You can trace all transactions across the globe with cryptocurrency. > with no way for the government to do anything about it Why is that a bad thing?

> You can trace all transactions across the globe with cryptocurrency

* Assuming KYC laws are enforced and account holders are listed

Re: We’re all criminals now

#27
post #5

The point of crypto currency is to do the exact thing money laundering laws try to prevent: to transfer large sums of cash untraceably across the globe, with no way for the government to do anything about it. Recently it's become a game of baseless investment, but anyone actually wanting to use crypto currencies as payment should've seen this coming from miles away.

> The point of crypto currency is to do the exact thing money laundering laws try to prevent No. That's not the point of cryptocurrency. > to transfer large sums of cash untraceably across the globe Wrong again. You can trace all transactions across the globe with cryptocurrency. > with no way for the government to do anything about it Why is that a bad thing?

> Why is that a bad thing?

It inhibits tax collection, which funds common goods. It also thwarts law enforcement, which is counter to public benefit.

We can debate whether taxes or laws or governments should exist. But they do, and most people seem to favor that. Debating a thing and actively subverting it are different. Just as subverting a thing and expecting such subversion to have no consequences or response are different.

Re: We’re all criminals now

#28
post #16
post #5

The point of crypto currency is to do the exact thing money laundering laws try to prevent: to transfer large sums of cash untraceably across the globe, with no way for the government to do anything about it. Recently it's become a game of baseless investment, but anyone actually wanting to use crypto currencies as payment should've seen this coming from miles away.

It's not just money-laundering laws. It's also more general "financial repression", i.e. being forced to hold local currencies while the government inflates them and/or holds the interest rate down. The two tend to blur into each other, I guess.

> two tend to blur into each other

Not entirely. Capital controls and currency bans are distinct from AML.

South Africa's proximate problem is capital controls. Cryptocurrencies make those controls easier to circumvent. If you look at the countries that are responding forcefully to crypto, it's the ones who want a sovereign monetary policy and relatively fixed exchange rate [1].

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impossible_trinity

Re: We’re all criminals now

#29
post #9
post #6

Your honor, can the prosecution please be compelled to demonstrate where the bitcoin physically exists? Oh on this computer? Well, the key is memorized and there are several copies saved all over the world in cloud computers. Can the prosecution show the court, physically, where in the computer the asset exists?

"This is a fairly recent “announcement” and many people are upset about the Reserve Bank making up seemingly hostile and uninformed rules regarding something that has no notion of borders and is practically impossible for the regulators to control in terms of owning and transferring. Something that arguably does not even exist in any one location..." So now, a memorized key or password means you are transferring "rig…

The law isn't new and expecting cryptocurrency to get a free pass. The guidelines for how to follow those laws make sense. If there is anything to be upset with, it is the law itself which is something that South Africans have had a long time to get changed.

Re: We’re all criminals now

#30
post #5

The point of crypto currency is to do the exact thing money laundering laws try to prevent: to transfer large sums of cash untraceably across the globe, with no way for the government to do anything about it. Recently it's become a game of baseless investment, but anyone actually wanting to use crypto currencies as payment should've seen this coming from miles away.

The whole crypto is bad, reminds me of the crypto wars where governments to this day try to outlaw encryption technology because bad guys can use it also.

You know ransomware encrypts data to make it inaccessible - we should ban encryption also.

Funny how it even shares the name with cryptocurrencies

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