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European Parliament approves mass surveillance of private communication

patrick-breyer.de

21–30 of 434 posts

Re: European Parliament approves mass surveillance of private communication

#21
post #9
post #6

Do they want everyone to switch en masse to end-to-end encrypted communications? Because this is how you encourage that.

Seems like the same legal body that made these laws would outlaw that activity.

Yeah, but how sustainable is the EU really, in the long term? I’m still convinced it will either dissolve or devolve into a rump organization within my lifetime.

Re: European Parliament approves mass surveillance of private communication

#26
post #3

I think it's the establishment, i.e. the old wealthy families who run things, are very concerned with the migrants crisis and the real possibility to lose control.

Lol. These "old wealthy families" caused the "migrant crisis"

Because they needed cheap labour. Now they're scared this cheap labor will get out of their control.

Re: European Parliament approves mass surveillance of private communication

#27
post #16
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that's true. Most people use Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp; privacy isn't really a selling point for the majority of people. "I've nothing to hide" is the common response.

Whatsapp is end to end encrypted.

The backups aren't. Same with iMessage. end-to-end has become a marketing buzzword, any large scale deployment gets backdoored (via either key or plaintext escrow) at the endpoints, to FISA/PRISM providers who have to turn it over to the state without a warrant.

China has the same setup with providers in their country.

WhatsApp and iMessage simply aren't private when the providers get ~100% of the plaintext transiting the service within 24 hours (immediately in the case of iMessage, as thanks to "Messages in iCloud" (cross-device sync) being on by default, the MIC sync key is escrowed to Apple in a non-e2e backup, permitting them to decrypt the sync traffic in realtime).

Truly private, easily accessible, society-wide private communications are a threat to sovereignty, and governments know this, which is why even europe (leading the way on individual privacy and rights on this planet, in general) is reluctant to permit it. Same goes for truly censorship-resistant, easily accessible payment systems. They allow you to coordinate (private/uncensorable messaging) and pay for (uncensorable payments) an army outside of state prerogatives, in theory.

Re: European Parliament approves mass surveillance of private communication

#28
>Previously secure end-to-end encrypted messenger services such as Whatsapp or Signal would be forced to install a backdoor.

Isn’t Signal FOSS? I don’t know how they’d police that when everyone can just fork it and remove the back door. Also don’t VPNs circumvent this legislation as well? How will they police self-hosted email servers?

I know the response to these questions is usually “You’re right, this is what happens when the techno-illiterate write laws” but I genuinely can’t think of how I would go about doing this if I was the one who wanted a back door.

Re: European Parliament approves mass surveillance of private communication

#30
post #10

Would any email provider protect me from this, get my emails actually delivered and ideally work with my own domain? Not that I see myself switching after 15 years and 6 Gmail accounts but if I am to I'd rather know who I'd use. And no I won't risk setting it up myself and risk missing on some portion of my emails like I've had happen at workplaces before we'd sigh and switch to Google. For Chat tg/signal seem like t…

> For Chat tg/signal seem like they would but I am less sure what the best option is for email.

Something that doesn't store the chats in a decryptable form on their servers is probably preferrable. So Telegram out and Signal, Threema or WhatsApp in.

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