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Five Oregon counties vote to leave state, create 'Greater Idaho'

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Re: Five Oregon counties vote to leave state, create 'Greater Idaho'

#21

Doesn't Eastern Washington also have a similar demographic? Maybe combine them too.

I believe there is a separate proposal somewhere being thrown around where Eastern Washington, North Idaho and Western Montana become a state...which really makes sense politically and commercially.

Source: I have lived in North Idaho most of my life...this is not a new proposal :)

Re: Five Oregon counties vote to leave state, create 'Greater Idaho'

#24

For reference, this is about 100K people of 4.2M in Oregon (1). The rural counties of Southern Oregon and Northern California have been proposing the state of Jefferson for a while now (2). From my experience living there for a few years, it's the most libertarian place I've ever seen. It's like Texas without the Christianity. People there generally support gay marriage, abortion, and cannabis legalization but also l…

It varies a lot. I spent some growing up years in Southern Oregon and there definitely was a strong evangelical, anti-gay marriage, anti-abortion etc. contingent in the town where I was. Lots of Birchers & KKK types as well. This was in the 70s and while the whole QAnon thing now is epistemlogically shocking, it seems like we had a lot of similar kinds of conspiracies running rampant in small southern Oregon towns ba…

I recently moved from Eagle Point so probably not too far away from where you were. It's certainly a strange and diverse set of people. Everything from weed growers to hippies to evangelicals to conspiracy nuts and everything in between. Most of the people I met there generally distrusted the government and couldn't care less about what you did on your own land.

Re: Five Oregon counties vote to leave state, create 'Greater Idaho'

#25

As an Oregonian not living in one of those sparsely-populated counties that voted for secession, I wonder why the folks who want to be part of Idaho don't just vote with their feet and move there? There's no border wall keeping them in Oregon. These votes are just symbolic and won't get them to their Idaho paradise near as quickly as a U-Haul could.

For all the times you hear "if you don't like it, leave", it does rub me as rich that they would want to move the line instead of stepping over it. I'm not saying it's easy, but giddy up, how about some pioneering spirit?

Re: Five Oregon counties vote to leave state, create 'Greater Idaho'

#26

As an Oregonian not living in one of those sparsely-populated counties that voted for secession, I wonder why the folks who want to be part of Idaho don't just vote with their feet and move there? There's no border wall keeping them in Oregon. These votes are just symbolic and won't get them to their Idaho paradise near as quickly as a U-Haul could.

Maybe they like their home, their community, and their neighborhood, but what they don’t like is having a bunch of people living in population centers far away who don’t share their values telling them how to live their lives?

Re: Five Oregon counties vote to leave state, create 'Greater Idaho'

#28
One of the things I periodically mentally noodle with is, what would the world look like if it was a lot easier for units to choose what larger units they would aggregate into? Like, cities choosing a county, counties choosing a state, states choosing their country, etc.

I originally was noodling with this in the context of a space civilization, where there is no equivalent of "solid ground", everything's always moving, and everything can move (i.e., even a "space station" can still move places, it just may be slower than a "space ship"), where these sorts of structures are probably inevitable because at the unit of 'space station' you can't hardly stop them from moving around between what various borders there may be.

But you can still noodle with the idea on planet Earth, too. Obviously, our current systems have a lot of institutional inertia in the direction of centralization; for instance, the various impacts this will have on the United States due to how we choose representatives, etc. But you can imagine a world in which this gradually becomes more popular, and imagine what the follow-on effects may be. And also consider why it not how things work here. There have also been times and places in history where things did work more like this, such as when and where "city states" were the dominant organizations rather than "nations".

(I present this as an interesting thought topic, not as the solution to the world's problems. I think one thing you will rapidly notice if you put serious thought into it is that especially on Earth, the nature of militaries has a lot of impact on why we find it advantageous to bundle into larger collectives than our neighbors. But I do find myself wondering whether over the next century or so we could save ourselves quite a few shooting wars if we were all more willing to break up amicably instead of fighting to the death over who gets to control tho overly-large, bloated collectives. Alas... we almost certainly won't.)

(Another example... in the space case, your choice of governance might actually manifest as concretely as the operating system your space ship or space station runs on, with its corresponding grants of permission or lack thereof to whatever higher powers your choice of governance has. And then that raises a whole bunch of further interesting possibilities.... on Earth though I would expect geography to still loom large on all discussions of sovereignty, though.)

Re: Five Oregon counties vote to leave state, create 'Greater Idaho'

#30
post #4

Why not just move to Idaho then? Or some other red state?

They are. Coeur d'Alene, ID is at the top of the US for hottest real estate markets. Average housing cost increase of over 40% in the last year. [1]

Boise and Eastern Idaho are seeing similar growth.

[1] https://www.wsj.com/articles/lakeside-idaho-city-is-americas...

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