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The Landlord's Game

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Re: The Landlord's Game

#21

For anyone curious about the philosophy behind this game, known variously as Georgism or Geoism, a decent review of the principle text, Progress & Poverty, was just posted on Astral Codex Ten: https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/your-book-review-progr... (A bit long, but pretty comprehensive and hey, it's shorter than the actual book).

I will take a look at this. But in the past, my (meager) attempts at understanding Georgism have not been very successful. I'd love to see some examples of what specific laws would be implemented, what taxation would look like (in actual percentages and dollar amounts) and things like that to understand what a system could look like in action.

There's a lot of different forms, and much like Pigoivian taxes that are intended to offset negative externalities, it can be hard to exactly find the right number. But even if one doesn't know the exact number, be it land rent or negative externality, getting closer than the arbitrary $0 can provide improvements.

For real estate, at the optimum land rent, land would exchange hands at a value of roughly $0 (structures on top of the land would modify the total property value). Given the high transaction costs of land, and of changing ownership, there are other forces that shift the true land price away from $0 under a full LVT.

There would need to be exemptions or other ameliorating of the coercive effects of full-land-rent LVT for those living in a primary residence. Nobody wants to force grannies out of their homes, for example. But the coercive effect of land taxation would otherwise mean that land would be used far more productively, with more stable prices and above all more affordable prices. It would also require getting rid of density restrictions that are not based in actual health and safety (ie pretty much all of them). But even somewhat small changes in density can open up massively more land for use.

It doesn't take many homeowners to completely shut off the market for land and corner it all. Not many people watch zoning boards, and fewer pay attention to how limited land use is, and even fewer who are in power do not directly benefit by the massive bubble on land prices.

And we really do have a massive bubble on land prices due to rentierism. So any sane deflation is going to require a gradual phase-in of an LVT, with probably 2+ decades of gentle deflation of land prices. And as soon as that starts in, there are the makings of a tax revolt. In California, we have been suffering from the tax revolt of Prop 13 for 50 years, and we are barely seeing any cracks in the army of anti-tax Prop 13 supporters.

So the politics of a full LVT are extreme, especially in a land where every middle class person is supposed to own a bit of land and defend it like a castle, and often when that defense means stopping any change. A full-on LVT is meant precisely to stop land hoarding, so as long as a majority of people see that land is theirs' to hoard, it's unlikely that an LVT will be passed. Unless imposed from in high by a technocratic elite that's trying to maximize social benefit, rather than individuals looking only to maximize their sole benefit.

Re: The Landlord's Game

#22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will take a look at this. But in the past, my (meager) attempts at understanding Georgism have not been very successful. I'd love to see some examples of what specific laws would be implemented, what taxation would look like (in actual percentages and dollar amounts) and things like that to understand what a system could look like in action.

There's a lot of different forms, and much like Pigoivian taxes that are intended to offset negative externalities, it can be hard to exactly find the right number. But even if one doesn't know the exact number, be it land rent or negative externality, getting closer than the arbitrary $0 can provide improvements. For real estate, at the optimum land rent, land would exchange hands at a value of roughly $0 (structure…

It’s an environmental anti-pattern.

Re: The Landlord's Game

#23
Monopoly was popular with kids on my block back in Palo Alto in the 60's. At least, it was omnipresent in collections, and we'd attempt to play it every so often...

I can't remember one game that didn't feature (a) disputes about rules and the administration of the bank; (b) animosity and dissatisfaction upon exit; and (c) hollow emptiness for the (newly friendless)"winner".

Re: The Landlord's Game

#24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a lot of different forms, and much like Pigoivian taxes that are intended to offset negative externalities, it can be hard to exactly find the right number. But even if one doesn't know the exact number, be it land rent or negative externality, getting closer than the arbitrary $0 can provide improvements. For real estate, at the optimum land rent, land would exchange hands at a value of roughly $0 (structure…

It’s an environmental anti-pattern.

People who live in dense areas use the least energy on average.

Re: The Landlord's Game

#25
> Any natural resource which is inherently limited in supply can generate economic rent... Georgists argue that taxing economic rent is efficient, fair and equitable.

Take out "natural" and it seems like any non-inflationary cryptocurrency would be a target for a Georgist tax.

Re: The Landlord's Game

#26
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kind of like how crypto was started as a reaction to broken financial institutions and is now being marketed as a get rich quick scheme. Sometimes we become what we set out or destroy.

> marketed as a get rich quick scheme I am seeing bus stop ads here in Sydney with a tagline from a BTC exchange saying something like "If you're seeing bitcoin on a billboard, it's time to buy". Now I'm hardly an astute investor but I thought the usual rule is that if your cabbie starts talking about it, it's time to get out of the market.

If your cabbie understands BTC you might have a point. We aren't even close to there yet

Re: The Landlord's Game

#27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s an environmental anti-pattern.

People who live in dense areas use the least energy on average.

Do you have numbers on that? The last time I looked it up, over here at least, that wasn't really the case. It seemed that while people in cities use less energy on personal transportation and housing, they consume much more goods and services than people in rural areas.

Re: The Landlord's Game

#28

For anyone curious about the philosophy behind this game, known variously as Georgism or Geoism, a decent review of the principle text, Progress & Poverty, was just posted on Astral Codex Ten: https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/your-book-review-progr... (A bit long, but pretty comprehensive and hey, it's shorter than the actual book).

I will take a look at this. But in the past, my (meager) attempts at understanding Georgism have not been very successful. I'd love to see some examples of what specific laws would be implemented, what taxation would look like (in actual percentages and dollar amounts) and things like that to understand what a system could look like in action.

Let's say you have a current property worth $1,000,000. 75% of the value is unimproved land, 25% is the capital improvements (house etc.) It's being rented out at $40,000 a year ($3,333 a month). 75% of the rent is economic rent of the unimproved value of the land, 25% is for the house.

So a 1% land value tax would be $10,000 a year. A 3% LVT would eat up the entirety of the economic rent.

However, the yield on that property would go down from 4% per annum to 1% per annum, so the value of the land would drop.

Any politically realistic implementation would involve progressively increasing the LVT and reducing other taxes over time, so the first year might be 1% LVT, but eventually the price of the property would drop such that a 100% LVT wouldn't be unreasonable (although an 85% LVT or thereabouts is often thought to work better).

Re: The Landlord's Game

#29

> Any natural resource which is inherently limited in supply can generate economic rent... Georgists argue that taxing economic rent is efficient, fair and equitable. Take out "natural" and it seems like any non-inflationary cryptocurrency would be a target for a Georgist tax.

The difference is you can opt out of the crypto game, not so easy with natural resources like land.

Re: The Landlord's Game

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a lot of different forms, and much like Pigoivian taxes that are intended to offset negative externalities, it can be hard to exactly find the right number. But even if one doesn't know the exact number, be it land rent or negative externality, getting closer than the arbitrary $0 can provide improvements. For real estate, at the optimum land rent, land would exchange hands at a value of roughly $0 (structure…

It’s an environmental anti-pattern.

Can you elaborate on how you reach that conclusion? A taxation system than encourages more efficient use of land leads me to the opposite conclusion.
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