Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money • Hacker News Board

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#21

Post by ghaff » Sat, Apr 17, 2021, 9:08 PM UTC

m463 wrote: post #11

ghaff wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure why the downvotes. That's absolutely a fair comment. There are some cases where creative work can benefit your day job through visibility and related skills. (A talented amateur actor is probably going to be better at presentations for example. And being that really good presenter at your company's user group event every year isn't going to hurt you.) But it seems a good point overall. Being great on som…

I would also say, people make more money doing stuff that's hard. (and of course the bar goes up)

I'd say "hard" is a necessary but not sufficient condition. People (individually or in the aggregate) also need to be willing to pay you specifically a lot of money for what you specifically bring to the table that, in many creative fields, requires being very top tier (and lucky).

In the arts, the equivalent of a mid-tier developer makes jack squat.

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#22

Post by ghaff » Sat, Apr 17, 2021, 9:09 PM UTC

Invictus0 wrote: post #16

ghaff wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure why the downvotes. That's absolutely a fair comment. There are some cases where creative work can benefit your day job through visibility and related skills. (A talented amateur actor is probably going to be better at presentations for example. And being that really good presenter at your company's user group event every year isn't going to hurt you.) But it seems a good point overall. Being great on som…

It's a bad comment because it totally misses the actual dynamics of the creative marketplace--that is, superstars-take-all. It has nothing to do with the "fun" of the work. The superstars in the creative industries are making 7-8 figures and everyone else is making 4-5 figures while trying to become a superstar.

And I would say that going into a field that requires hitting the jackpot to not be waiting tables as a day job isn't a great strategy from an expected earnings perspective. (Which isn't to say people shouldn't do it if that's their thing.)

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#23

Post by 101008 » Sat, Apr 17, 2021, 9:14 PM UTC

Finnucane wrote: post #19

He doesn't seem to understand what a royalty is. He quotes himself saying "To compensate for their 85% share of the royalties, a publisher needs to sell at least 5x more copies for you to break even [compared to self-publishing]." As the lady on the tv says, that's not how any of this works. In trade publishing at least, the author's royalty is a percentage of the cover price of the book. In normal retail selling, th…

As a publisher author of a non-fiction book with an established publisher, I had to stop reading after that first point because he is completely wrong.

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#24

Post by apocalypstyx » Sat, Apr 17, 2021, 9:16 PM UTC

ed25519FUUU wrote: post #6

It seems to me that virtually everyone going into the creative fields (art, music, writing, acting) should enter that field without any expectation to make a living from it. We pay other people to do things that aren’t fun for us, not the other way around.

The owners of and investors in publishing houses, movie studios, and music labels tend to expect something beyond 'making a living'. Whereas those who actually generate cultural phenomena (our culture, aka the shared framework of references that allows us to define an us) see little to nothing from work that is foundational to multi-billion dollar media empires. Not making a living means that the class of people most free to engage in cultural creation are those who are independently wealthy.

'Follow your passion' brings with it the perversity of if you love it, then that should be reward enough. Much in the way that doctors and nurses have been labeled as 'heroes' is used as a smoke screen to not increase pay or alleviate working conditions because you love your work and can you really be a hero if you expect money from it?

One way or another, it seems, human society appears bent on perpetuating the idea that some people should generate value for others without compensation in regards to that value.

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#25

Post by currymj » Sat, Apr 17, 2021, 9:19 PM UTC

how much are these numbers skewed by academic monographs? these are books that are basically going to be sold only to university libraries, which might explain why they sell there are many such books where no author ever expects to make money -- they have other incentives due to the way academia is organized.

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#26

Post by krmmalik » Sat, Apr 17, 2021, 9:20 PM UTC

I'm an author of a non-fiction book. I self-published. My book has a 5-star rating to date even though it was published nearly 5 years ago. My book meets most of the criteria laid out in this book. I even had both a publisher and distributor approach me and I had plenty leverage. Despite all that, I didn't get the book sales I wanted nor the PR.

Everyone that reads my book is surprised to hear it's not topping the charts or plastered everywhere my audience hangs out. My book beat out all the competition when it came out in terms of reviews.

While the points in this post are valid, I don't believe they get to the bottom of what holds back sales.

Frankly, I don't know what the answer is -- I have a vague idea of what it could be but I haven't had a chance to try those things. Perhaps if my book had been in all airport bookstores a few years ago, it might have taken off (no pun intended) like Tim Ferriss' book but who knows.

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#27

Post by DubiousPusher » Sat, Apr 17, 2021, 9:21 PM UTC

> It’s because Hemingway’s Boat is broadly “about” a topic, whereas The War of Art promises—and delivers—an outcome.

I certaintly don't know a damn thing about selling books. But I am an avid reader of nonfiction and this is exactly the opposite of how I shop for books myself.

Other than the odd "how-to", I'm skeptical of any book promising me anything other than the author's diligent study and incisive distillation of a topic. I've read many books which caused my mind to grow and really excited me about the world but I've never read a book that "solved my problem". Of which, I assure you, I have many.

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#28

Post by UperSpaceGuru » Sat, Apr 17, 2021, 9:32 PM UTC

krmmalik wrote: post #26

I'm an author of a non-fiction book. I self-published. My book has a 5-star rating to date even though it was published nearly 5 years ago. My book meets most of the criteria laid out in this book. I even had both a publisher and distributor approach me and I had plenty leverage. Despite all that, I didn't get the book sales I wanted nor the PR. Everyone that reads my book is surprised to hear it's not topping the ch…

I just bought your book based on the post above. Maybe it’s marketing? Your book is also aimed a small niche(I’m on your target market!), maybe that’s it?

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#29

Post by gxqoz » Sat, Apr 17, 2021, 9:41 PM UTC

currymj wrote: post #25

how much are these numbers skewed by academic monographs? these are books that are basically going to be sold only to university libraries, which might explain why they sell there are many such books where no author ever expects to make money -- they have other incentives due to the way academia is organized.

My impression is that even reasonably well-selling non-fiction books typically do not sell a lot of copies. To make it onto a best-seller list you only need to sell in the tens of thousands of books.

Re: Why most non-fiction authors don't make any money

#30

Post by ddorian43 » Sat, Apr 17, 2021, 9:43 PM UTC

DubiousPusher wrote: post #27

> It’s because Hemingway’s Boat is broadly “about” a topic, whereas The War of Art promises—and delivers—an outcome. I certaintly don't know a damn thing about selling books. But I am an avid reader of nonfiction and this is exactly the opposite of how I shop for books myself. Other than the odd "how-to", I'm skeptical of any book promising me anything other than the author's diligent study and incisive distillation…

> but I've never read a book that "solved my problem". Of which, I assure you, I have many.

Curious of your unsolved problems.