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Ask HN: I've realized I'm a bad software engineer and I'm over 30, what's next?

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Re: Ask HN: I've realized I'm a bad software engineer and I'm over 30, what's next?

#21

1. The quality of your work as a developer has no bearing on the quality of your work as a PM. It's a different skillset altogether and you may or may not have it but your experience as a developer is only an asset when applying to be a PM. Whether you decide to go in that direction is a personal decision, but you should do it because you're interested in that kind of work, not because you think that your software wo…

Adding on to this, the kind of "hacky" code you produced while freelancing or working with small companies may have been entirely sufficient for that kind of problem. Now that you're a programmer in a much larger institution the way you code will need to change. It's going to feel very foreign to you for the first few months. The processes and patterns are almost entirely different and it's okay to take a lot of time to adjust.

Re: Ask HN: I've realized I'm a bad software engineer and I'm over 30, what's next?

#22
I'd argue differently. Congrats for having the courage to recognize your problem.

The analogy that comes to mind is I've been playing basketball in my local town, and now I've gotten promoted to play in the big city. I now feel like a small fish in a big pond.

If you enjoy software engineering, I'd say, double down. Now that you're at the medium software company, seek mentorship and coaching from others.

In addition, there might be more homework (hitting the gym sort of), things you also have to do on your own.

It isn't going to feel good being humbled and I've been there myself. But if you think about the goal as "learning to get better" than "prove to others I am better", you'll have a better time walking through this challenge. This all comes from a person who is a PM.

So some tactical thoughts of possible advice: 1. Face the issues head on -> take all the negative feedback on the code and rework the medium complexity task 2. Learn to unlearn bad habits. Yes, it's harder, but it comes with practice. 3. Commit to maybe taking a course work online (maybe seek advice from others on what are good ones to address weaknesses you have)

Hope this helps.

BTW, you don't need to be able to code things the right way to be a PM. Coding is only one specific skill and not always necessary for a PM.

Re: Ask HN: I've realized I'm a bad software engineer and I'm over 30, what's next?

#23
Sounds to me like you just need to get better at refactoring. The first working code for a feature should be a mess because it's a learning exercise. The important thing is that you don't stop there and push to develop; refactor the initial working-but-messy code so that it becomes well structured and self documenting.

Re: Ask HN: I've realized I'm a bad software engineer and I'm over 30, what's next?

#24
There's a thing called the imposter syndrome, which a lot of software engineers seem to experience through their career.

Also, one needs time to get used to a new project, new environment, new colleagues, etc.

In every domain, the more you learn, the less you feel knowing about, and that's a good sign.

In this industry, the ones that make it, are the ones that keep on going forward.

Re: Ask HN: I've realized I'm a bad software engineer and I'm over 30, what's next?

#25
> I'd been assigned a medium complexity task and I've failed to accomplish it, the code was all filled with hardcoded values, wrong structure, difficult to debug bugs and similar things.

First thing is work out to spin this properly - you're seeing this as a failure with hindsight, but why is it really like that? E.g: were the requirements firmly defined or were you trying to hit a moving target? Were you trying to appease too many owners? Were you lazy? Lack support? The most valuable thing you can provide is some objective context around why things are the way they are. Theres also different "software engineers". Maybe its the company type that you dns fit in well with? Rule number one: cut yourself some slack like you've probably given the other folk involved in the project.

Re: Ask HN: I've realized I'm a bad software engineer and I'm over 30, what's next?

#26
> I'm thinking about looking for semi senior roles but I'm afraid it'll look weird for the company interviewing me to hire a semi senior with +10 years of experience.

I think this is definitely an option if you want to go for it. There might be some companies who will discriminate against you, but they'll definitely be some who won't. The key will be explaining to them (and convincing them) that the reason you're not as senior as one might expect is because you were never exposed to good practices or challenged to do better, rather than because you tried and failed to learn how to do things better. It sounds like this is genuinely the case, so I imagine it wouldn't be too hard to find people you can convince.

However:

> If you read my resume it'll seem I am a senior but I don't really know where to place me in the "experience" spectrum

To me it very much sounds like "junior". So it really depends if you are prepared to suck it up and learn everything afresh with an open mind. If you are, then I'd certainly be willing to hire you for a junior position (if I were interviewing you).

Re: Ask HN: I've realized I'm a bad software engineer and I'm over 30, what's next?

#27
Just to be clear, Product Management is not really a backup role for bad Software Engineers, unless that is what they were really good at instead of coding.

If you are bad at PM you can do mid-long term damage to a product which is not fixable like a problem in the code.

PM might have coding experience or not, it helps a lot if they do, but good PMs have a set of skills which are completely unrelated to being a software developer.

Re: Ask HN: I've realized I'm a bad software engineer and I'm over 30, what's next?

#28
post #7

Don't beat yourself up - if you've gone 10 years without failing at a task then you did a lot better than I did. At least you recognise where the problems were - why not try and fix those problems in your next bit of work?

Also sometimes the best cure is more practice. You need to replace one set of habits with another.

Start small. Like how to do a flavor of integration testing. Perhaps take some online courses? There is also a huge amount of YT vids out there.

One thing you may need to do is go back to the basics. Also make a task of it. Have a set time where you for 1 hour a day 'learn new coding skills'. Such as refactoring, code style and when and why to us it. Also find a project that you are interested in and follow it. I learn quite a bit doing this I have a dozen or so I follow and watch the pull requests to see interesting uses of code and style, even if I disagree with them. I do not contribute to them but I follow the style and commits they do. You can learn a lot by doing your own code reviews of other peoples code. Seeing how other do it and work on that.

Re: Ask HN: I've realized I'm a bad software engineer and I'm over 30, what's next?

#29

Do you want to be a software developer still? (That isn't clear from your summary). If so, you need to learn better habits. I suggest picking up a book on the subject, like "Code Complete" (at Amazon or wherever books are sold. Pretty sure it's at the library if you'd rather read it for free -- but it'll do better as a reference book on your desk for a few years). Use it and start practicing with personal projects ho…

Thirding Code Complete (another top-level recommended it). I read that book very early on, and I credit it with my current ability to write clean code.

Another good one is The Pragmatic Programmer.

Lastly, this wiki is a gold mine of wisdom from hardened devs: http://wiki.c2.com/?StartingPoints

I really recommend you read lots and lots of those pages.

Re: Ask HN: I've realized I'm a bad software engineer and I'm over 30, what's next?

#30
I don't see what the big deal is. Just go back and improve your code. Your team needs to be patient, nobody should be expected to push perfect code in every commit, even seniors.

If you can spot your own code smells, you're doing fine. Otherwise, read up on how to do so. I recommend Code Complete.

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