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Senior Engineers Build Consensus (2019)

hyperbo.la

21–30 of 123 posts

Re: Senior Engineers Build Consensus (2019)

#21
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s called an oligarchy in politics. Can’t say it’s a great operational model

You've probably noticed that there aren't really any successful companies that are run as democracies. There are good reasons for that.

Co-ops?

Re: Senior Engineers Build Consensus (2019)

#22
Is this not kind of intuitive to people?

If you rock up and go, "we're doing this big thing tomorrow and oops sorry we didn't mention it before" of course you're going to encounter more push back.

On the other hand, if you get people on your team before doing something then they will trust you and possibly even become advocates!

Re: Senior Engineers Build Consensus (2019)

#23

I used to work with an engineer who would have a loud negative emotional reaction the first time they were told about some new thing that would be happening at our company, and after a little bit would be totally fine with it. After one or two instances of this pattern, the manager learned to talk to the engineer ahead of time, so the upset reaction wouldn’t happen in a big meeting. I suspect that more of us are like…

I obviously don't know why this engineer reacts the way they do, but I can see myself reacting that way not because of the change itself but because there was no advance warning or discussion.

Re: Senior Engineers Build Consensus (2019)

#24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who used to work at LittleBigCo, I think this beats having great ideas and then having them given to people who are in the inner circle with the founders. At least BigCo isn't super fratty like LittleBigCo tends to be. Or I could be wrong, please tell me if I'm wrong. I want to be wrong. Lots of LittleBigCo's these days are pushing overhyped products and are mostly just having fun with corporate money.

oh i agree - that's why i left a streak of startup jobs to get paid more to do less at BigCo. BigCo isn't fratty at all in my limited experience. Be professional, follow whatever 10 commandments the C-suite prints out & laminates for you, and sell yourself once a year in self-review and you'll win out and barely work if you're remote. Smaller companies have very little org-chart structure - it's a single small tree.…

You sound like me. Cheers. I hope it works out for us.

Re: Senior Engineers Build Consensus (2019)

#25
post #16

One can use Nemawashi to lay the foundation for consensus. An even more powerful technique is to use Numerology to identify the consensus that already exists. See https://github.com/jart/cosmopolitan/blob/master/libc/sysv/s... and https://justine.lol/ape.html

Is this spam?

Re: Senior Engineers Build Consensus (2019)

#26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

oh i agree - that's why i left a streak of startup jobs to get paid more to do less at BigCo. BigCo isn't fratty at all in my limited experience. Be professional, follow whatever 10 commandments the C-suite prints out & laminates for you, and sell yourself once a year in self-review and you'll win out and barely work if you're remote. Smaller companies have very little org-chart structure - it's a single small tree.…

You sound like me. Cheers. I hope it works out for us.

[deleted]

Re: Senior Engineers Build Consensus (2019)

#27
Sometimes consensus is impossible. You have to move on without it. Either you get stasis, or gradual change, or revolution or fracture/fork and no matter what you get dissent, consequences and cost.

Consensus doesn't always exist. Its great to build it and its great to seek it.

Re: Senior Engineers Build Consensus (2019)

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

oh i agree - that's why i left a streak of startup jobs to get paid more to do less at BigCo. BigCo isn't fratty at all in my limited experience. Be professional, follow whatever 10 commandments the C-suite prints out & laminates for you, and sell yourself once a year in self-review and you'll win out and barely work if you're remote. Smaller companies have very little org-chart structure - it's a single small tree.…

What do you mean by BigCo? Fortune 500 non-tech? Faang?

That fits the bill without giving me away, yeah :)

Re: Senior Engineers Build Consensus (2019)

#29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

oh i agree - that's why i left a streak of startup jobs to get paid more to do less at BigCo. BigCo isn't fratty at all in my limited experience. Be professional, follow whatever 10 commandments the C-suite prints out & laminates for you, and sell yourself once a year in self-review and you'll win out and barely work if you're remote. Smaller companies have very little org-chart structure - it's a single small tree.…

You sound like me. Cheers. I hope it works out for us.

> Cheers

You too! Let this be a lucrative but minor (ergo efficient) period of our lives :beers:

Re: Senior Engineers Build Consensus (2019)

#30

10x engineers get it done without others even knowing about it.

And this is how you end up with an entire engineering team that has no idea what the hell is going on. Don't be a "10x engineer". Empower 10 other people around you. That's what the real 10x engineers are doing.

When I joined my current company, I was the only software engineer working on embedded firmware (with plenty of help from folk with non-software backgrounds.) I had about a year and a half of frantic coding to set the foundation in place, and now almost 5 years in we have an embedded team of over a dozen people. I'm not particularly interested in management, and there has been no pressure for me to go that route, so I've successfully remained a leaf in the org chart. My current manager is the third person we hired to the embedded team, just a year or two out of school at the time, and he's doing an awesome job. I feel like I probably have a lot of political power within the organization, but I can't really say because I never need to use it. I'm lucky enough to generally like everyone I work with.

New folk in other parts of the company ask me what I do, and the best way I can describe it these days is meta-engineering. Rather than take long term ownership of any part of the system, I take temporary ownership of the scary parts that need the most attention, refactor them until they're as boring as I can using a suitably large sledgehammer, and then release them back into the wild to (hopefully never) be someone else's problem again. When I'm not doing that, entire weeks go by just reviewing coworkers' PRs, writing architecture documents, and interviewing job candidates. I'm widely known for bluntly (but hopefully respectfully) giving my opinion when weighing in on technical subjects I think I know about, and it seems to be well received. Pretty much all direct and indirect feedback I get is to keep doing that more. Many coworkers even send me their designs and PRs with an explicit request to mercilessly tear it apart.

I've been addicted to watching episodes of "Kitchen Nightmares" this past month, and I just realized that it's sorta like what I do at work, but with less swearing and the undercooked chicken is lack of regression test coverage. Also, the restaurant doors haven't closed up 6 months later yet!

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